Rexstang

iTrader: (1)

They are not fighting occupiers, that is the term used for creating cause. Believe me we don't want to be there. We want to create a stable non terrorist producing government that can rule themselves. When we decimated the ****'s and Japan did we stay? No, we rebuilt their country, presented them with a democratic government and allowed them to rule themselves. Then we left. We'll leave Iraq too. But we won't leave it in the hands of people who will turn around and vow our destruction. We are only there because of the instability created from Saddam's removal. The fighting is due to the power vacuum of groups who will be left out of power when the democratic process is instituted. Most hold extremist views and we won't allow another Taliban type government to take over.

gpatmac

iTrader: (3)

He meant severing. Oh shoot. That is in bad taste.

Anyhow, I usually try to argue subjects where I'm not stating my opinion when it's based loosely on facts. That's what I believe that you're doing, Mr Unregistered. You're describing the situation based on your experiences. I will tell you that you are not as travelled as you believe you are.

I will spell it out to you as such. We weren't occupying ANYWHERE when Khomeini's followers took 90 hostages in 1979.

We weren't occupying Yemen when the USS Cole was attacked.

It could be argued by one who is shortsighted and ignorant of the diplomatic maneuvering and the tactical situation on the ground that we were 'occupying' Saudi Arabia in 1996 when Khobar Towers was attacked.

Yada, yada, yada. I could go on and on and you know that I could.

I have a feeling that I already know your answer, but what sort of a situation would exist if the US were nationalistic and isolationistic? Well, I'll tell you. Do you remember a tiny footnote (which my money says will once again begin percolating soon, as soon as we're fully out of there) called the Balkans? Those folks could give a damn about us. Their one and only aim is to kill one another. There is no exageration in that statement. Read: the Muslim Albanians are looking to hurt and kill as many Serbian men, women and children as possible, and vice versa. Granted, this isn't specifically a case of Muslim extremism, but a reference to why our presence is sometimes critical in another nation.

Now to discuss the extreme Muslims, I can speak with experience (as a codicil, I've only been to Afghanistan) after having dealt with them in direct and indirect fire contact, after having incarcerated them, after providing resources to their villages, after having provided doctors to their families...

They are not interested in the least with anything that doesn't adhere to what they believe life should be about.

They are a minority, but a vocal, active, and dastardly minority is very dangerous to a slovenly, scared, and immobile majority. They know that this is their number one asset, both in the diplomatic world as well as the tactical.

If there was no action taken to stifle, and hopefully eliminate every single one of these 'extremist' Muslims, they will begin to spread their bile. They believe that everyone should be a Muslim. If you are a Muslim, you must live according to strict translation of their Holy Quran. If you don't adhere to the edicts of the Quran, you will pay a painful and sometimes mortal price for crimes that we would consider to be minor, for good reason. Because they are. If you were a Muslim, according to these extremists, the Mullahs who were responsible for law would understandably become autocratic since that's the only mechanism that would work in order to control vast numbers of folks, to the point where the citizens' existence was a bleak one. You know people. They wouldn't stand for that too long. It's not as though lawlessness and hedonism could be banned.

Magish

iTrader: (2)

Though I do belive that much he says is true...


I would still love to move to europe. I have been there for extended periods of time on a few occasions and find it to be much nicer than here. Don't get me wrong, I love america, but I find in many ways Europe to be much more "inline" with my views (though I do not like the part about it as mentioned in this article)
-Jeff

Unregistered

Concidering this isn't my first language then yes that would be in bad taste. And since im packing to go skiing when I typed this then...(Sad part is I was THANKING YOU for your service since almost all my friends are in the Army since I grew up in a ARMY base. I guess next time I'll get off my "moral high ground" and say **** you.) First off I said it again and again I think they are a problem but we are going in the wrong way of dealing with them. And that this article is portraying all of them as extreemist which is not true. When did I ever say I didn't recognize this as a problem. I might not be able to spell everything correctly when Im not paying attention but you sure can't comprehend simple sentences. (See I can be a ******* too! Wow, gold star for me!)

And I'm proably more travled than most individuals. And have experienced terroism first hand, so saying my "televised world" is completly, well for lack of a better word at 5am in the morning, retarded. Both of you need to learn reading comprehension because I never stated this wasn't as issue. I was stating that the article was "wrong" in the way it was portraying muslims as a WHOLE. Sheeesh how much more blunt can I get?

Also what you both need to do is read up on your histroy concerning the time during Hitler and the Crusades. And tell me which road you wanna head down because you can't take out a faith. No one has ever been able to do that. And I would love to hear both of your rationalizations on how this is possible to do? Oh and how do you distinguish between a extreemist and a non-extreemist?

One last thing, my family in Spain has dealt with ETA since before I was born. You know that little terrorist organization in Europe. So I think I have a "clue" on what it is to live in fear of terror.

Unregistered

Funny, concidering I LIVED WHERE THE ARTICLE IS TALKING ABOUT FOR OVER TEN YEARS OF MY LIFE. And I visit REGUARLY since I have half my family there! Not including my GERMAN friends that I still talk to this day. Maybe your making broad generalizations without KNOWING the facts about who you are talking about. I don't believe im well travelled in Europe I KNOW I am since I have been all over Europe. And actually lived there LONGER than I have lived in the US. But I guess you know more than me right? You also know the racist attitudes MANY germans have against muslims and turks? Oh and you have experienced it first hand like I have since you have family that resembles turks/muslims? Yep you sure pegged me down for just stating my opinion, which is "based loosely on facts." This article is portraying ALL muslims as extreemist and as I stated before and I'll state again its WRONG.

Unregistered

Maybe I'll try this angle. Germans feel about muslims what most border states to Mexico feel about mexicans. This article portrays that sentiment exactly and why I disagree with it.

VIBEELEVEN

iTrader: (2)

I still fail to see the part of the article that generalizes ALL muslims as extremists

gpatmac

iTrader: (3)

Why so touchy? You're even saying **** me when I never attacked you at all. I attacked your argument.

I'm done. I don't argue with children.

Oh and bytheway, we're talking about an issue, not the article. The article is just something we're referencing to shape the argument. The topic of terrorists in EUROPE is not the issue.

Salty

iTrader: (14)

I don't think he knows who you are, Pat... I still love you though.

gpatmac

iTrader: (3)

I'm nobody. It boils down to this. Whether I'm right or wrong in this argument, he's obviously a passionate but immature guy to resort to calling someone names over a bbs.

I guess as far as knowing who I am, yeah, you're probably right. If we were eye to eye, I guarantee that he would be keeping to the subject at hand.

IS2Scooby

iTrader: (3)

I was at the drug screening lab today (pre-employment drug screening) and while I was waiting for "the urge" I was reading some issues of Time magazine. Many of them had articles dealing with Islamic fundamentalism, and their extreme proponents. Wow. It was scary stuff.

It's strange to know that there are people out there that literally want to KILL ME, not ever having met me just because I'm not Muslim. Through no fault of my personal intentional actions towards them or their society/culture/religion do they want to do this. No, they just want me to be dead because I am not of their faith, and do not believe in their Allah.
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Rexstang

iTrader: (1)

I have a question, just out of pure curiosity. What effective actions have European governments taken to curb global terrorism?

This is a serious question and not aimed at any particular religion, race or government. We all seem to agree terrorism exists and I hope to agree that we all think it needs to be stopped. And I believe what the article is trying to say is that Europe needs to do something proactive about it other than bash the Americans and Brits for making an attempt to curb the terrorist threat that currently exists abroad and at home.

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