Risk3233

I'm campaigning a 1990 Miata this SCCA season here on Maui.

Let's just say that there couldn't be a bigger difference between racing a Miata and an STi.

The Miata relies on momentum and smooth driving. Precision is key and smooth inputs yield quick times. The car is very sensitive to tire pressure, tire temps, wheel weight.

The STi on the otherhand is a sledgehammer. It likes to be pushed around and not finessed. It wants quick inputs and very agressive braking, turn-in and acceleration. A little bit of throttle-brake overlap result in even quicker times.

I tried to drive my Miata like my STi today and spun it twice on the same run. Big fun...

BLUEJ20

iTrader: (35)

well goodluck and have fun this season

YamazakiSubaru

iTrader: (8)

Woo hoo! I'm happy to see there are other Miata/STi guys out there! (hey, it's not what you think...)

b_drift

iTrader: (12)

haha. i'm the opposite. i've spun my old sti a few times on 245 race rubber and never spun my miata yet.

b

Risk3233

Anytime you develop a new car for racing, there is a learning curve. For example. I set the air pressure on the Miata similar to those on my STi - 42 psi in front and 38 psi in the rear. Let's just say that this high pressure on a car that's 1,000 lbs. less than an STi and has 1/3 the power was like trying to ride a skateboard on frozen ice. I wasn't able to generate any cornering grip/traction and I looked like Rhys Millen in D1 competition. Let's just say that I saw my rear bumper more often than I saw the front of my car.

A veteran Miata racer told me to drop the pressure to 30 psi front and 28 rear. I started to make the slow reductions in pressure and finally settled on 31 front and 28 rear. Wow, what a difference. The car had tons of grip and was able to generate cornering with gentle steering input and throttle application.

Moral of the story. Being able to setup one type of car doesn't mean you can use the same settings on a completely different kind of car. If I had read the sticker on the door that stated that the recommended psi for the Miata is 26 lbs. I would have had a better starting point than using my STi's settings.

Oh well...racing is a process...not just a result.

islandx

iTrader: (3)

Wow, b you spun the STi ?

That's crazy, considering your driving style.


And I totally agree with risk, AWD relies on mass inputs and very rough driving technique. Very aggressive turn in, and the ability to totally lift off throttle mid turn in order to tighten up the line.


That however is one of the reasons I sold my WRX, I felt that it encouraged "bad habits"

My miata on the other hand, while easy to drive is the type of car that will "teach" the driver. If you do something wrong, the car will let you know.

Risk3233

I agree. Driving a Miata will expose bad driving, yet at the same time it can be one of the quickest cars at any Solo event in the hands of a good driver.

I've driven all major drivetrain layouts in Solo competition - RWD (Hachi); FWD ('97 GTI VR6); AWD (STi) and now the Miata.

Out of all the cars, the Miata requires the best technique from me in order to be quick. You just can't afford to scrub off any momentum driving the Miata, or else you will lose time.

b_drift

iTrader: (12)

i think i am just weird then. to me the miata is one of the easiest cars to drive after the mini s. compared to the 89 4dr civic, 97 civic coupe, 89 240sx, 90 240sx, 03 wrx wagon, 04 sti, 01 mini s, 02 mini s, 90 240sx sr20det, 89 240sx sr20det, 91 2dr civic, 92 240sx sr20det, 2006 350z and finally 99 miata that i have owned and scca'ed(might have missed a couple cars). to list the other cars i didn't own but have autoxed would be teh funny.

the miata is nimble enough to let you do whatever you want. the sti was heavy and moved where momentum was going. the mini is just a freak FF car and badness on race rubber. the civics were hard to drive with their true FF plow characteristics. aside from when i drove kyle arai's drift setup.

haha. now steve and myself are going to try our best to ruin the balance of our miatae and overpower them. hellz yeah!!

b

YamazakiSubaru

iTrader: (8)

So what does it mean that I did about equally as well (poorly, actually) with BOTH the STi and Miata? I know I'm a rubbish driver, but if one was easier for inexperienced drivers, wouldn't that show in my case? For what it's worth, I enjoy the STi more and will be sticking with that after I get back to Hawaii.

Risk3233

If I had made smaller "transitions" between cars then maybe I'd find the Miata an easier drive.

But going from all the grip, power and stop of an STi to my 90 Miata w/no ABS, RWD (opem diff), and a 1.6 liter with close to 150k on the odo requires an adjustment.

Once we get the setup nailed-down, the car will be quick. The car was just 2 seconds off the CSP winning times and that car was on Avon Tech-Rs and had a Torsen diff. Our car has potential.

I just need to adjust the nut behind the wheel to get the full potential from the car. I've got nothing but time to learn how to drive this car. IMO if you can drive a Miata fast, then when i step in the STi, watch out.

I can speak only about my driving and my experiences with the cars I drove.

b_drift

iTrader: (12)

not for me. i got FTD with the 91 civic and FTD with the 240sx det. never in my sti or wagon. in fact closest was maybe a top 5 with the sti. the miata on the otherhand has never gotten a ftd but has a few 2nd OA's and probably should've ftd' this past race but tire failure ended (overheat)that.

just the steering issues with the sti hold it back. if it followed the evo, it would be easy to drive and fast.....

haha. funny thing was when i tried to drive lil'man chu's wrx during a fun run after not racing FF or awd for almost a year. i sucked hard. then i jumped into larry's civic and sucked hard again. i have been spoiled by the miata and it is starting to show.

risk. if you lay off racing your sti for 6 months or so and only drive the miata(esp on race tires) then hop in the sti, you will more than likely plow the first hard turn (if you make some at your track) seriously, the miata spoils the driver into thinking they are fast.

just like a xb driver thinks their car corners good stock. it doesn't really, but the underpoweredness of the car makes it seem like it does since you can't get into trouble.

b

Risk3233

There is some truth to this observation. The Miata doesn't have to lift in some corners where you have to be textbook in the STi - straight-line brake, turn-in, apex, throttle. The Miata is so balanced that you can essentially take it flat out.

I've got the run-offs in the STi as the last event and I'll probably do test-n-tune sessions just to stay on top of the handling. However, the long term racer is now the Miata.

It's great to see what I consider an "underdog" type of car in the Miata embarass much more expensive and technologically advanced cars. Low buck, low tech racing at its finest.

islandx

iTrader: (3)

I really don't think that the FFS will ruin the balance of the miata, with only 18lbs added to the front passenger side.

Overpowered maybe, but can't we just go half throttle where we would previously go full ?

Now a high hp turbo system with it's peaky power delivery would certainly make life difficult at auto-x.

poser

try going to a car with double the HP, torque, and weighs 100lbs less, but now with run flat tires instead of R-comps...

talk about having to make adjustments...

Risk3233

I just read b drift's comment about turns on our track or lack thereof.

FYI we had a series of turns that looked like the kink at the 24 Rolex race this weekend. We had a combination of slow (1st gear corners) and the usual high speed stuff. I actually had to do a 3-1 downshift in the Miata. That was a challenge to actually use some heel-toe downshift in a brakezone.

I heard that your courses are so tight that STis don't even get out of 1st. What kind of challenge is that? j/k