How many of you still run MBC's?
10-12-2004, 04:09 PM
#3
it'll work with an EBC no problem. I don't want to say that it works with an ecutek reflash because it really depends on the tune. In theory it should work just fine, but I won't give a guarantee unless I can monitor the car with the OLM installed.
-- Ed
-- Ed
10-12-2004, 05:24 PM
#4
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Originally Posted by vaus
it'll work with an EBC no problem. I don't want to say that it works with an ecutek reflash because it really depends on the tune. In theory it should work just fine, but I won't give a guarantee unless I can monitor the car with the OLM installed.
-- Ed
-- Ed
10-12-2004, 05:36 PM
#5
Dahveed aka Robin Hood
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Originally Posted by Silver arrow
I just switched from EMI and MBC to accessport and I miss the quicker boost of the MBC. Wish they had a stage 2 map for use with a MBC. Would be killer.
https://www.i-club.com/forums/bay-area-15/introducing-ed-vaus-here-i-club-he-can-help-those-you-mbcs-75849/
10-12-2004, 08:02 PM
#7
Originally Posted by 240sxer
whats an OLM?
10-13-2004, 12:44 AM
#9
Originally Posted by Silver arrow
same thing as the Vishnu EMI
The OLM is indeed similar to the Vishnu EMI in concept. Both units intercept the TPS signal to force the ECU into open loop under part throttle, high boost conditions.
I personally have never used an EMI adapter, but have heard that it can be jerky at lower rpm transitions.
The final version of the OLM uses a microcontroller which allowed me to smooth out the transition through the entire RPM range to make it virtually invisible to the driver. The microcontroller also allowed me to make the OLM's fairly cheaply, and as I remember, Vishnu's EMI was in the vicinity of $250.
-- Ed
Last edited by MethodBuilt; 10-13-2004 at 12:47 AM.
10-13-2004, 09:24 AM
#10
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I started with a bleeder/constrictor. I thought it was a pain. Then I got an MBC. It was much nicer, but still a pain. Then I got an EBC and thought MBCs were the stupidest device evAr. Then I got a UTEC and refused to use the MBC and still use my EBC to control boost, as many do. When I get some other issues back in order I'm going to put a GM BCS in place of the EBC and let the UTEC control boost. I'll never go back to an MBC, ever.
jason
jason
10-13-2004, 12:08 PM
#11
Jason,
which MBC were you using and what did you not like about it? Why was your EBC so much better? From past experience, a good ball and spring MBC spools the turbo quicker and is more consistant in condition changes than any EBC I've seen... especially the UTEC's boost control system. Just wondering what you don't like about them?
-- Ed
which MBC were you using and what did you not like about it? Why was your EBC so much better? From past experience, a good ball and spring MBC spools the turbo quicker and is more consistant in condition changes than any EBC I've seen... especially the UTEC's boost control system. Just wondering what you don't like about them?
-- Ed
10-13-2004, 12:56 PM
#12
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I'm running a mbc. Works great and spools quick. Took my roomate for a ride and scared him with how fast it was. As for the ptfb problem I just floor it up to speed and cruise. I rarely am at that condition. With over 300hp and awd I floor it everywhere. I may not be the most effiecent driver on the road, especially at $2.47 a gallon, but I'm the driver with the biggest smile on my face.
10-13-2004, 03:06 PM
#13
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Originally Posted by vaus
Jason,
which MBC were you using and what did you not like about it? Why was your EBC so much better? From past experience, a good ball and spring MBC spools the turbo quicker and is more consistant in condition changes than any EBC I've seen... especially the UTEC's boost control system. Just wondering what you don't like about them?
-- Ed
which MBC were you using and what did you not like about it? Why was your EBC so much better? From past experience, a good ball and spring MBC spools the turbo quicker and is more consistant in condition changes than any EBC I've seen... especially the UTEC's boost control system. Just wondering what you don't like about them?
-- Ed
EBC: a good, fast reacting, preferably dual solenoid, unit that accurately controls boost from within the cab that can be changed on the fly and has peak-hold capabilites (like my Blitz Spec-R) is like heaven on earth in comparison to an MBC.
An MBC that spools quickly will also spike. You can't adjust boost gain on an MBC. With proper tuning between gain and efficiency on an EBC you can always out do an MBC. If you've never seen an EBC that outpeforms an MBC in boost characteristics, you don't know how to work an EBC.
UTEC: You can look me straight in the eye and tell me this about a UTEC vs a stand alone MBC for boost control? I want some of what you're smoking! Honestly I don't think you realize how a UTEC controls boost. An MBC has one setting for all circumstances. If you put boost to come on to quickly down low you will spike up top. If you put it so that you don't spike up top you will be sluggish down low. Sometimes you can get a nice compromose but it will always be a compromise. You can never max out the potential all around with an MBC. With a UTEC on the other hand, I can discretely control boost with an 11x44 grain map (RPM vs TPS). No compromises. Since I can also control the fuel delivery I can easily compensate for PTFB. I can switch maps on the fly for any weather...
The pricetag might be 30 times greater... but then I can also control timing and fuel deliver and get more consistent, all around uncompromised power than you'd ever see with an MBC.
MBCs are toys for playing around a little with your boost.
jason
10-13-2004, 04:40 PM
#14
Jason,
It sounds to me like the main reason you dislike MBC's is because you can't adjust them from in the cabin. Although I never found this to be a big problem, there is a moddle of the hallman that can be adjusted from the cabin with great accuracy. As far as weather changes, I'm not sure what you're talking about. My MBC if very consistant from cold to hot, to humid, to dry, and doesn't evern vary significantly between gears. What you're describing are the characteristics of a bleeder type MBC, not ball and spring. Because its so consistant, I don't have the need to be changing it constantly, so I'm not really upset that I have to pop my hood to do it.
EBC's are cool, but only high end, expensive units that implement true closed loop control work well at all... the others vary widely with weather and load. As far as the UTEC, I know they claim a closed loop boost control system, but from past experience with it, its far from that. Tell me that your UTEC controlled boost doesn't vary up to 2psi depending on gear, not to mention weather, and I'll drop this point entirely.
To each his own, but IMO the mechanical simplicity of a ball and spring MBC is perfect for the otherwise complex job of boost control.
-- Ed
It sounds to me like the main reason you dislike MBC's is because you can't adjust them from in the cabin. Although I never found this to be a big problem, there is a moddle of the hallman that can be adjusted from the cabin with great accuracy. As far as weather changes, I'm not sure what you're talking about. My MBC if very consistant from cold to hot, to humid, to dry, and doesn't evern vary significantly between gears. What you're describing are the characteristics of a bleeder type MBC, not ball and spring. Because its so consistant, I don't have the need to be changing it constantly, so I'm not really upset that I have to pop my hood to do it.
EBC's are cool, but only high end, expensive units that implement true closed loop control work well at all... the others vary widely with weather and load. As far as the UTEC, I know they claim a closed loop boost control system, but from past experience with it, its far from that. Tell me that your UTEC controlled boost doesn't vary up to 2psi depending on gear, not to mention weather, and I'll drop this point entirely.
To each his own, but IMO the mechanical simplicity of a ball and spring MBC is perfect for the otherwise complex job of boost control.
-- Ed
10-13-2004, 05:19 PM
#15
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If you use the factor restrictor hose with a MBC it kills spikes and has fast response if set in third gear. Had for 2 years and never spiked. rock solid. I set it to 15 psi in the winter and it would go to 16.5 in summer and I never touched it. I miss the fast response wish I could use it with AP.