Downshifting
07-13-2003, 03:48 PM
#1
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Downshifting
Can someone explain to me clearly how to downshift so I don't have to coast and use the brakes to slow down. I tried a few times but i'm too nervous to mess up and jerk the car like crazy. I think I am pretty good now with accelerating, just need to work on slowing down. Thanks!
07-13-2003, 06:15 PM
#2
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Ok maybe I should specify a little bit. Ok so i'm going about 45 in 4th gear, if i want to go to 3rd gear to slow down I press the clutch and put in 3rd,... now this part is where i'm confused. Can i let go of clutch bout half way and engage throttle to rev match and then let go of clutch? is that okay or is that too harsh on the clutch? 
I know its okay to just pop in neutral and brake, but I heard that wears down the brakes fast.
I know its okay to just pop in neutral and brake, but I heard that wears down the brakes fast.
07-13-2003, 09:02 PM
#3
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If you are not racing or anything like that it is not terribly hard on the clutch to just let it out, the clutch will grip and then it will slow you down, throttle match, or heel/toe, is mostly used when in autox or racing so that your car does not jerk and throw off the front/rear weight balance. But yeah rpm matching will allow it to ease into gear alot more. But that is what synchros are for. 
07-14-2003, 02:22 PM
#4
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you're going 45mph in 4th...which is about 2400rpm
first clutch in, shift to 3rd, blip throttle about to about 3700rpm.
clutch out slowly taking about twice the time you would
clutch out during a shift up. you should have no grinding
noises or any jerky feeling. the hardest part is to keep your
throttle around 3700rpm while you enagage your clutch.
during the blip, step on the gas lightly but quickly so that
your rpm builds quickly but not to overshoot 3700rpm. slight
over shoot is okay..its is better to over shoot a down shift
than to under shoot the rpm and clunk the drivetrain.
after you start letting out the clutch gently, you can work
your throttle a little more to keep it either steady at 3700rpm
or to slow down by letting out the gas. unless you are
quickly braking, your blip throttle should be kind of long and
smooth. if you are in a racing situation, then your blip is
rather short and accurate that it reaches 3700rpm. dont rush
things, just take your time first.
you should practice traveling 50mph in 3rd, 4th, and 5th gears
without jerking the car. gear should go like this 3-4-5-4-3-4-5-4-3-4-5-4-3-4-5-4-3, etc. it takes a while to get use to it, but
this is probably the best way to get your body to memorize
downshifts. be ready to pay a lot of gas money. hehehehe.
after you can do that, you can start learning about heel and
toe. but you should really understand how to downshift smoothly
so dat you dont break your tranny.
first clutch in, shift to 3rd, blip throttle about to about 3700rpm.
clutch out slowly taking about twice the time you would
clutch out during a shift up. you should have no grinding
noises or any jerky feeling. the hardest part is to keep your
throttle around 3700rpm while you enagage your clutch.
during the blip, step on the gas lightly but quickly so that
your rpm builds quickly but not to overshoot 3700rpm. slight
over shoot is okay..its is better to over shoot a down shift
than to under shoot the rpm and clunk the drivetrain.
after you start letting out the clutch gently, you can work
your throttle a little more to keep it either steady at 3700rpm
or to slow down by letting out the gas. unless you are
quickly braking, your blip throttle should be kind of long and
smooth. if you are in a racing situation, then your blip is
rather short and accurate that it reaches 3700rpm. dont rush
things, just take your time first.
you should practice traveling 50mph in 3rd, 4th, and 5th gears
without jerking the car. gear should go like this 3-4-5-4-3-4-5-4-3-4-5-4-3-4-5-4-3, etc. it takes a while to get use to it, but
this is probably the best way to get your body to memorize
downshifts. be ready to pay a lot of gas money. hehehehe.
after you can do that, you can start learning about heel and
toe. but you should really understand how to downshift smoothly
so dat you dont break your tranny.
Last edited by kenchan; 07-14-2003 at 02:28 PM.
07-22-2003, 06:56 AM
#6
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The only time that you would need to do heel-toe is when you actually need to brake and downshift. As stated earlier, heel-toe is only used when autoX, track racing, or when you have to stop fairly quickly in traffic.
But if you just want to slow down, without using the brake, by downshifting, you should not have to heel-toe, therefore, your foot shouldn't touch the brake petal. The steps are the same as upshifting, with the exception of blipping the gas while your clutch-in.
But if you just want to slow down, without using the brake, by downshifting, you should not have to heel-toe, therefore, your foot shouldn't touch the brake petal. The steps are the same as upshifting, with the exception of blipping the gas while your clutch-in.
07-22-2003, 07:54 PM
#7
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Car Info: 02 WRX wagon=dead; rollin' in a Craptastic Camry!
08-01-2003, 05:08 PM
#9
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Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 175
well if your coming to a red light in 4th... just go into N and ride out the brakes. its much easier and cheaper to replace brake pads than it is to replace a clutch. i only downshift taking turns and whatnot, but comin to a stop... i just ride the brakes.
08-10-2003, 02:25 AM
#10
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Location: southern california
Posts: 513
Car Info: 98 L w/hybrid ej257 Linked
what is it about 3700 RPM? or is it just an example number..
and when i attempt heal-toe (while not moving car off) i cant touch both pedals like the pedals are to small or somehting..
and when i attempt heal-toe (while not moving car off) i cant touch both pedals like the pedals are to small or somehting..
08-18-2003, 01:59 PM
#11
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Join Date: Feb 2003
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Posts: 488
Car Info: black my03 5mt wrx s/w
Originally posted by Fantabulous
well if your coming to a red light in 4th... just go into N and ride out the brakes. its much easier and cheaper to replace brake pads than it is to replace a clutch. i only downshift taking turns and whatnot, but comin to a stop... i just ride the brakes.
well if your coming to a red light in 4th... just go into N and ride out the brakes. its much easier and cheaper to replace brake pads than it is to replace a clutch. i only downshift taking turns and whatnot, but comin to a stop... i just ride the brakes.
i rev match about 90 percent of the time. the other three percent is either coasting to a stop where i know i won't be moving again, or letting the clutch come up very slowly to avoid jerking the car.
i actually test my driving method by carrying a small cup of water in the cup holder. if some splashes out, i'm not driving smooth enough!
jm2c
ken
08-19-2003, 12:17 PM
#12
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I usually just down shift before I start braking. I don't fully rev match, I just get it close enough with a blip of the throttle and take it up smoothly. Everything seems fine so far.
08-26-2003, 04:51 PM
#15
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Try viewing the videos on this BMW M5 driving site:
http://www.bmwm5.com/greg/school/
1. Introduction Introduction (8.7mb)
2. Seating Position. Yes, it matters. (9.4Mb)
3. Gentle Launch - How to start when you're just relaxing. (10.3Mb)
4. Moderate Launch (6.2Mb)
5. Aggressive Launch (7.7Mb)
6. Upshifting, part 1 - A discussion of the objective (8.3Mb)
7. Upshifting, part 2 - See it, hear what it should and shouldn't sounds like. (7.4Mb)
8. Single clutch, rev-matched downshifts (7.4Mb)
9. Double-clutching (15.9Mb)
10. Heel and toe, part 1 - a discussion of the technique (9.1Mb)
11. Heel and toe in action (8.4Mb)
12. Putting it all together, part 1 - a quick tour of a very short road, (10.7Mb)
13. Putting it all together, part 2 - A quick trip with launch, up- and downshifts while pushing hard. Includes a demonstration of power-on oversteer, and the ease with which the M5 can be gathered back up, even with DSC off.
The site is on a pretty bad server so try it on non-peak hours. It only allows 10 visitors at a time and only 100kb/sec data transfer which is slow for broadband (in my area anyway.)
http://www.bmwm5.com/greg/school/
1. Introduction Introduction (8.7mb)
2. Seating Position. Yes, it matters. (9.4Mb)
3. Gentle Launch - How to start when you're just relaxing. (10.3Mb)
4. Moderate Launch (6.2Mb)
5. Aggressive Launch (7.7Mb)
6. Upshifting, part 1 - A discussion of the objective (8.3Mb)
7. Upshifting, part 2 - See it, hear what it should and shouldn't sounds like. (7.4Mb)
8. Single clutch, rev-matched downshifts (7.4Mb)
9. Double-clutching (15.9Mb)
10. Heel and toe, part 1 - a discussion of the technique (9.1Mb)
11. Heel and toe in action (8.4Mb)
12. Putting it all together, part 1 - a quick tour of a very short road, (10.7Mb)
13. Putting it all together, part 2 - A quick trip with launch, up- and downshifts while pushing hard. Includes a demonstration of power-on oversteer, and the ease with which the M5 can be gathered back up, even with DSC off.
The site is on a pretty bad server so try it on non-peak hours. It only allows 10 visitors at a time and only 100kb/sec data transfer which is slow for broadband (in my area anyway.)