Ford's STi Killer?
04-22-2003, 11:06 PM
#16
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally posted by essogas
Janq, I can't view these links you put up... Nothing happens. Another browser window opens to a blank screen.
Janq, I can't view these links you put up... Nothing happens. Another browser window opens to a blank screen.
Its a link to a WMV (Windows Media - Video) file.
Here is the complete url; http://www.drunkstunts.com/videos/tr..._crash_300.wmv
- Janq
04-23-2003, 09:34 AM
#18
Originally posted by SpeedRacerWRX02
also every ford i ever owned is reliable. not to sound dumb but in 34 years when there is a svx or wrx or rs still running and worth some good cash then we can talk about reliability. but they dont build em like they used to
also every ford i ever owned is reliable. not to sound dumb but in 34 years when there is a svx or wrx or rs still running and worth some good cash then we can talk about reliability. but they dont build em like they used to
Part of the reason Toyota and Honda own the market today is because Ford and the other domestics built cars that only lasted 5-6 years. Also, the Focus has been getting better on reliability (as has the Neon) nearly every year since release, but I remember that reliability issues were a major reason why it wasn't a bigger success in the US. Consumer reports even downgraded the rating of the Focus because of it.Contrast that to Subaru, who often tout that 95% of all Subarus sold since 1985 (or something like that) are still on the road today...
Take it as you will.
04-23-2003, 09:46 AM
#19
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 1,402
Car Info: 02 WRX wagon=dead; rollin' in a Craptastic Camry!
Originally posted by SpeedRacerWRX02
also every ford i ever owned is reliable. not to sound dumb but in 34 years when there is a svx or wrx or rs still running and worth some good cash then we can talk about reliability. but they dont build em like they used to
also every ford i ever owned is reliable. not to sound dumb but in 34 years when there is a svx or wrx or rs still running and worth some good cash then we can talk about reliability. but they dont build em like they used to
Also consider the number of Mustangs built from '65-'71 compared to the number of SVX's and Impreza's sold in the states between '95 and '01.
FWIW, my grand dad has a '71 Ford pick up with almost 300K on the clock, and those are hard miles on a farm and bumpy dusty dirt roads. My dad has a '99 F350 with 65K miles and tips the scales at just under 10,000 lbs. fully loaded with his tools. No trouble with that Ford either, except for a gas cap issue covered under warranty.
04-23-2003, 10:56 AM
#20
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally posted by BlingBlingBlue
Actually, the Japanese took market share because of the US oil embargo. If there had been no oil embargo (due to the US' own heavy handed foreign policy from the republican Johnson, Nixon, Ford administrations) then to this day we would still be driving Cordoba's, Mirada's, LTD's, Galaxie's, Chevelle's and Impala's.
The big three were in fact caught flat footed while Honda, Toyota & VW had been selling small & easy on gas (nothing like todays econo cars though!) but fun to drive coupes, roadsters, sedans and trucks worldwide and to a small degre in the states for decades prior.
After the oil emabrgo and resulting decade long recession was over the general US populace had come to be better acquainted with imports and began demanding better build quality from the domestics. To 'solve' this problem gool ol' boy Ronald Reagan instituted "tariffs" against all imports to help 'even the playing field' for the Big Three. Basically a US auto industry end move to keep US dollars in the pockets of US Corp. heads at the expense of the customer buying product with a life expectancy of 5 years max.
Well, the imports took the tariff in stride and just reduced internal operating costs and added the traiff costs to the overal cost of the car...and kept their boat loads coming. And as history says, US buyers kept on calling. Today its been over 30 years of unfair tariffs and for the most part the Big Three (now Big Two that Chrysler was bought by Daimler which was totally ironic & moronic) still struggles to compete against any of the imports whether it be Subaru/Porsche/Hyundai (tiny), Honda/Toyota/VW (huge!) or BMW/Mercedes/Mitsubishi (equal in size to GM & Ford). There is an old saying; "Put your money where your mouth is!". Well the US consumer for the past 30 years have done just that and thats why the imports are gaining US market share in a big way (look at Mitsubishi!) and the domestics are still against the ropes.
Bad analogy. You are comparing apples to oranges. Two totally different vehicle classes from two totally different economic times for two totally different types of buyer.
Next time you visit your grandad take a look at the construction of his '71 Ford. No, take a close look.
It's a body on frame design with several individualy bolted body panels and an engine with trans. The front & rear suspension is archaic ('50's technology) and the interior is no better than an average John Deere tractor...metal dash, a few gauges, some window glass and maybe some paint.
Thats not all too impressive. And of course its still on the orad. It ought to be as there is essentially nothing to break (manual window regulators maybe) as its very simple and basic in design.
Now your dads F-350 is a bit more modern and has more technology. But to say its still running is no wonder. it's only 4 years old and 65K miles shouldn't be remarkable.
Now converesely my '93 Legacy AWD which has been a daily driver and sees 'Extreme Use' as deemed by my Subie mechanic is 10 years old and has 181K miles on all factory parts. The only changes are a new starter pinion (last summer at 170+ miles), new front rotors (last week at 180+ miles), new rears rotors (last fall at 170+ miles) and a new automatic trans (2 years ago at 130+ miles) which was replaced under _warranty_ which Subie offered to extend as they failed to add the trans cooler upgrade when it was new. I doub't Ford will stand behind their products that long.
I've had four other Subies, including a '92 SVX that I sold at a profit (!) with 93K miles, as well as several GM, Ford, VW, Honda ('03 Pilot) and Volvo ('00 V40 Wagon) products. I can honestly say the that other than the VW ('87 Cabriolet) the imports show their age much better and are cheaper to keep for the long run.
I have nothing against domestics, though I do have a problem with paying hard earned money for consistently & historically proven inferior product. I don't care who makes it or where the parts are sourced from as long as I don't have to buy a new car every 3 years or 70K miles.
- Janq
I agree with your statement, "they don't build 'em like they used to". Ford (as well as GM and Chrysler) used to make a very good car, then came the 70's and 80's. The Japanese took market share because they were able to build economical and more reliable cars that were more fun to drive than big American iron. Detroit has realized this and things are turning around...
The big three were in fact caught flat footed while Honda, Toyota & VW had been selling small & easy on gas (nothing like todays econo cars though!) but fun to drive coupes, roadsters, sedans and trucks worldwide and to a small degre in the states for decades prior.
After the oil emabrgo and resulting decade long recession was over the general US populace had come to be better acquainted with imports and began demanding better build quality from the domestics. To 'solve' this problem gool ol' boy Ronald Reagan instituted "tariffs" against all imports to help 'even the playing field' for the Big Three. Basically a US auto industry end move to keep US dollars in the pockets of US Corp. heads at the expense of the customer buying product with a life expectancy of 5 years max.
Well, the imports took the tariff in stride and just reduced internal operating costs and added the traiff costs to the overal cost of the car...and kept their boat loads coming. And as history says, US buyers kept on calling. Today its been over 30 years of unfair tariffs and for the most part the Big Three (now Big Two that Chrysler was bought by Daimler which was totally ironic & moronic) still struggles to compete against any of the imports whether it be Subaru/Porsche/Hyundai (tiny), Honda/Toyota/VW (huge!) or BMW/Mercedes/Mitsubishi (equal in size to GM & Ford). There is an old saying; "Put your money where your mouth is!". Well the US consumer for the past 30 years have done just that and thats why the imports are gaining US market share in a big way (look at Mitsubishi!) and the domestics are still against the ropes.
Also consider the number of Mustangs built from '65-'71 compared to the number of SVX's and Impreza's sold in the states between '95 and '01.
FWIW, my grand dad has a '71 Ford pick up with almost 300K on the clock, and those are hard miles on a farm and bumpy dusty dirt roads. My dad has a '99 F350 with 65K miles ...
It's a body on frame design with several individualy bolted body panels and an engine with trans. The front & rear suspension is archaic ('50's technology) and the interior is no better than an average John Deere tractor...metal dash, a few gauges, some window glass and maybe some paint.
Thats not all too impressive. And of course its still on the orad. It ought to be as there is essentially nothing to break (manual window regulators maybe) as its very simple and basic in design.
Now your dads F-350 is a bit more modern and has more technology. But to say its still running is no wonder. it's only 4 years old and 65K miles shouldn't be remarkable.
Now converesely my '93 Legacy AWD which has been a daily driver and sees 'Extreme Use' as deemed by my Subie mechanic is 10 years old and has 181K miles on all factory parts. The only changes are a new starter pinion (last summer at 170+ miles), new front rotors (last week at 180+ miles), new rears rotors (last fall at 170+ miles) and a new automatic trans (2 years ago at 130+ miles) which was replaced under _warranty_ which Subie offered to extend as they failed to add the trans cooler upgrade when it was new. I doub't Ford will stand behind their products that long.
I've had four other Subies, including a '92 SVX that I sold at a profit (!) with 93K miles, as well as several GM, Ford, VW, Honda ('03 Pilot) and Volvo ('00 V40 Wagon) products. I can honestly say the that other than the VW ('87 Cabriolet) the imports show their age much better and are cheaper to keep for the long run.
I have nothing against domestics, though I do have a problem with paying hard earned money for consistently & historically proven inferior product. I don't care who makes it or where the parts are sourced from as long as I don't have to buy a new car every 3 years or 70K miles.
- Janq
04-23-2003, 12:46 PM
#21
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: utah
Posts: 62
Car Info: 2000 RS coupe ej-20 swap
umm.........
hell Janq thanks for the novel................
Although I do agree with you. The only part you may have gone a little south on was daimler's purchase/union with chrysler. Very smart move for daimler. The countless millions they've made on marketing their suv's in the americas has made it well worth their while. And the fact that they can now build their cars on U.S. soil at factories in Detroit and Alabama makes it possible for them to sell twice as many cars in the U.S.. Mercedes is a popular "marc" in the rest of the world, but more commonly as a cheap car. It is not known as such a prestigous possesion in the rest of the world as it is in North America. Traveling to other countries, you'll see more mercedes vans, and utility vehicles than you ever would have imagined. I know this from various years of living outside of the states. However many foreigners view the chrysler as a sign of success, and many high class foreigners drive chryslers. With Daimler's focus on suv's in the states, their sales of suv's in europe has increased dramatically among the "high-class." The U.S. high class seems to set the standard world-wide of what is in.
Other than that, I couldn't agree with you more.
As far as this earlier statement,
[QUOTE]
[The Taurus immediately comes to mind as an example, a fine car for the masses that has proven reliable.
/QUOTE]
Blingblingblue obviously never owned a Taurus. Those cars are more than notorious for the time spent in the transmission shop. My opinion of why sales went so far for them was because of the countless corp. who used them for fleet cars. My father owned a Taurus from '89-'99 changing to a new model every two years. We were able to drive a lot of different vehicles during this time period. Thanks to the leasing company who provided a rental for the months of time these "reliable tauruses" spent in the shop.
Domestics have a long way to come to be competetive in the car market. They own the truck market, and always will, but until they can build a quality car for the price that they do in the orient, I'll continue buying imports.
Although I do agree with you. The only part you may have gone a little south on was daimler's purchase/union with chrysler. Very smart move for daimler. The countless millions they've made on marketing their suv's in the americas has made it well worth their while. And the fact that they can now build their cars on U.S. soil at factories in Detroit and Alabama makes it possible for them to sell twice as many cars in the U.S.. Mercedes is a popular "marc" in the rest of the world, but more commonly as a cheap car. It is not known as such a prestigous possesion in the rest of the world as it is in North America. Traveling to other countries, you'll see more mercedes vans, and utility vehicles than you ever would have imagined. I know this from various years of living outside of the states. However many foreigners view the chrysler as a sign of success, and many high class foreigners drive chryslers. With Daimler's focus on suv's in the states, their sales of suv's in europe has increased dramatically among the "high-class." The U.S. high class seems to set the standard world-wide of what is in.
Other than that, I couldn't agree with you more.
As far as this earlier statement,
[QUOTE]
[The Taurus immediately comes to mind as an example, a fine car for the masses that has proven reliable.
/QUOTE]
Blingblingblue obviously never owned a Taurus. Those cars are more than notorious for the time spent in the transmission shop. My opinion of why sales went so far for them was because of the countless corp. who used them for fleet cars. My father owned a Taurus from '89-'99 changing to a new model every two years. We were able to drive a lot of different vehicles during this time period. Thanks to the leasing company who provided a rental for the months of time these "reliable tauruses" spent in the shop.
Domestics have a long way to come to be competetive in the car market. They own the truck market, and always will, but until they can build a quality car for the price that they do in the orient, I'll continue buying imports.
04-23-2003, 03:04 PM
#24
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: umm.........
[QUOTE]Originally posted by liberty2000rs
[B]hell Janq thanks for the novel................
Although I do agree with you. The only part you may have gone a little south on was daimler's purchase/union with chrysler. Very smart move for daimler. The countless millions they've made on marketing their suv's in the americas has made it well worth their while. And the fact that they can now build their cars on U.S. soil at factories in Detroit and Alabama makes it possible for them to sell twice as many cars in the U.S.. Mercedes is a popular "marc" in the rest of the world, but more commonly as a cheap car. It is not known as such a prestigous possesion in the rest of the world as it is in North America....Other than that, I couldn't agree with you more...
[QUOTE]
Oh, I agree with you too about Daimler and especially their non-US presence and position. They are similar to Volvo in that respect.
And the purchase of Chrysler was a prudent and smart move on their part. I would have done the exact same thing if I were them though I would have called it for what it was. It was an outright lock, stock & barrel purchase, not a merger as they initially marketed. Maybe that was to make us yanks feel better about the whole deal.
I find the enitre situation for Chrsyler corp to be "ironic" as they were at one time a big three and considered their products to be leading edge in design & development (30's to late 60's). They alos have a long automotive history shared with the Ford & GM of derision toward Mercedes in specific (the oldest commercial auto manufacturer) as they were looked down on as being 'european' and not quite getting it.
Well, 100 years later and billions of units later it seems Mercedes has had the last laugh in purchasing outright. Further, they now have essentially become one of the US' big three auto manufacturers...a european. Oye vey!
As for "Moronic", thats for the chowder heads at Chrysler who let the company go into bankruptcy, twice, only to be saved by Uncle Sam and then Lee Iaccoca (who designed the original Mustang and then went on to become President of FoMoCo) in the '80's with his 'mini-van' idea (and to a lesser degree the 'K-Car' platform). But no, with all this help and a nearly 60% market share in the domestic arena during the '80's & early '90's, what do they do? Nothing. They rest on their laurels and figure selling Dodge Caravan's is enough and that anyone who deosn't want a Caravan would want a Grand Caravan or rebadged Mitsubishi 'Mirage' named Colt. Oh, and they kept selling 70's and 80's technology based body on frame vehicles all the way through to the latter part of the '90's.
Meanwhile everyone else including the 'Big Two' and Nissan and Honda carbon copied the Caravan and sold them at lesser cost with increasingly betterbuild quality.
Then those geniuses at Honda took things one step further and borrowed a technique from the folks at Sony.
Copy a preoduct, then take it apart down to its most base components then rebuild it recreating the exact same thing only improving each individual piece to the point that the new whole no longer resembles the original starting device...but it does the same functions only better, quicker, quiter and with less cost to manufacture.
The result of their efforts was the Honda 'Odyssey' mini-van.
An outright success from the start and to this very day dealers still can't keep in stock, all the while selling them at MSRP plus markup.
Meanwhile Dodge sees the writing on the wall to late and they hear that giant sucking sound again for the third time. But this time Daimler sees whats going on and recognizes they can get Chrysler for a song (and dance). They tender a 'meger' offering, the Chrysler head honcho's buy off on it thinking they will have jobs for life and free S classes to boot.
Then when the ink on the deal isn't even dry yet the Daimler folks begin forcing out the top folks, eliminating duplicative jobs (at Chrysler of course) and place their own people in top US spots.
Two years later Chrysler is fully digested and assimilated and is all but a 'brand image' for US buyers.
Duh! I ask, how could they not see this coming?
Maybe they were focused on the pipe-dream of having Mercedes stock, winter homes in Dusseldorf with Caravans that actually have nice transmissions & build quality. Who knows.
All I do know is that its absolutely moronic.
All that hard earned and famous _US_ automotive history gone to be stored in a warehouse somewhere in a Mercedes backlot.
Walter Chrysler and the Dodge brothers must be spinning in their graves. While Gottlieb Daimler and Carl Benz must be grinning with delight. Especially with "Chryslers" latest offerings of the 'Pacifica' and 'Crossfire'.
- Janq
[B]hell Janq thanks for the novel................
Although I do agree with you. The only part you may have gone a little south on was daimler's purchase/union with chrysler. Very smart move for daimler. The countless millions they've made on marketing their suv's in the americas has made it well worth their while. And the fact that they can now build their cars on U.S. soil at factories in Detroit and Alabama makes it possible for them to sell twice as many cars in the U.S.. Mercedes is a popular "marc" in the rest of the world, but more commonly as a cheap car. It is not known as such a prestigous possesion in the rest of the world as it is in North America....Other than that, I couldn't agree with you more...
[QUOTE]
Oh, I agree with you too about Daimler and especially their non-US presence and position. They are similar to Volvo in that respect.
And the purchase of Chrysler was a prudent and smart move on their part. I would have done the exact same thing if I were them though I would have called it for what it was. It was an outright lock, stock & barrel purchase, not a merger as they initially marketed. Maybe that was to make us yanks feel better about the whole deal.
I find the enitre situation for Chrsyler corp to be "ironic" as they were at one time a big three and considered their products to be leading edge in design & development (30's to late 60's). They alos have a long automotive history shared with the Ford & GM of derision toward Mercedes in specific (the oldest commercial auto manufacturer) as they were looked down on as being 'european' and not quite getting it.
Well, 100 years later and billions of units later it seems Mercedes has had the last laugh in purchasing outright. Further, they now have essentially become one of the US' big three auto manufacturers...a european. Oye vey!
As for "Moronic", thats for the chowder heads at Chrysler who let the company go into bankruptcy, twice, only to be saved by Uncle Sam and then Lee Iaccoca (who designed the original Mustang and then went on to become President of FoMoCo) in the '80's with his 'mini-van' idea (and to a lesser degree the 'K-Car' platform). But no, with all this help and a nearly 60% market share in the domestic arena during the '80's & early '90's, what do they do? Nothing. They rest on their laurels and figure selling Dodge Caravan's is enough and that anyone who deosn't want a Caravan would want a Grand Caravan or rebadged Mitsubishi 'Mirage' named Colt. Oh, and they kept selling 70's and 80's technology based body on frame vehicles all the way through to the latter part of the '90's.
Meanwhile everyone else including the 'Big Two' and Nissan and Honda carbon copied the Caravan and sold them at lesser cost with increasingly betterbuild quality.
Then those geniuses at Honda took things one step further and borrowed a technique from the folks at Sony.
Copy a preoduct, then take it apart down to its most base components then rebuild it recreating the exact same thing only improving each individual piece to the point that the new whole no longer resembles the original starting device...but it does the same functions only better, quicker, quiter and with less cost to manufacture.
The result of their efforts was the Honda 'Odyssey' mini-van.
An outright success from the start and to this very day dealers still can't keep in stock, all the while selling them at MSRP plus markup.
Meanwhile Dodge sees the writing on the wall to late and they hear that giant sucking sound again for the third time. But this time Daimler sees whats going on and recognizes they can get Chrysler for a song (and dance). They tender a 'meger' offering, the Chrysler head honcho's buy off on it thinking they will have jobs for life and free S classes to boot.
Then when the ink on the deal isn't even dry yet the Daimler folks begin forcing out the top folks, eliminating duplicative jobs (at Chrysler of course) and place their own people in top US spots.
Two years later Chrysler is fully digested and assimilated and is all but a 'brand image' for US buyers.
Duh! I ask, how could they not see this coming?
Maybe they were focused on the pipe-dream of having Mercedes stock, winter homes in Dusseldorf with Caravans that actually have nice transmissions & build quality. Who knows.
All I do know is that its absolutely moronic.
All that hard earned and famous _US_ automotive history gone to be stored in a warehouse somewhere in a Mercedes backlot.
Walter Chrysler and the Dodge brothers must be spinning in their graves. While Gottlieb Daimler and Carl Benz must be grinning with delight. Especially with "Chryslers" latest offerings of the 'Pacifica' and 'Crossfire'.
- Janq
04-23-2003, 03:29 PM
#25
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: umm.........
[QUOTE]Originally posted by liberty2000rs
As far as this earlier statement,
If it weren't for driving schools (Escort/Cavalier), cops (Crown Vic & Taurus/Caprice), Schools (Full size vans), rental car companies (everything Chevy & Ford), taxi drivers (Crown Vic & Taurus/Caprice) and the Govt. (everything)...GM & Ford would be in a serious bit of pain.
I'm talking kicked in the family jewels with wooden clogs hurt.
Think about it. When is the last time you could rent a Honda Accord, or been pulled over by a BMW driving cop (not counting CA motorcops), or gone to school event in a Toyota Sienna, or hailed a cabbie driving a Camry or saw a public official driving around town with "GOVT USE ONLY" plates in an Avalon?
It just doesn't happen.
Now think of all the states, municiplaties and taxis and rental cars in the US alone. Yet some how GM & Ford will have you believe they are suffering due to unfair trade practices by imports.
Hmm...?!?
Meanwhile, Toyota, Honda, Subaru, Porsche (which is tiny!), Nissan, Mitsubishi, BMW, Mercedes, Hyundai, not even VAG (which Americans geberally seem to be okay with) requires a govt. handout to thrive and be succesfull on our shores. Oh, and they don't hand out 'buyers incentives', 'cash back financing', 'zero percent interest' or other product devaluing "deals" to convince/trick buyers into their showrooms. No they somehow get by on just fresh designs and quality product.
Dang, how do they do that?!
Well enough GM & Ford bashing.
I just wish they would get serious and catch up with the rest of the world. I mean for pete's sake Toyota is already going into v2.0 with its super cool electric-car 'Prius' (which is going to be a HUGE hit) while BMW has real hydrogen powered vehicles operating on the road. Heck, my '04 Honda Pilot SUV doesn't require a tune-up but once every _105,000_ miles as indicated in the owners manual!
I wonder how many tune-ups that '73 Ford has had in its 300K mile life. My Honda would have had three.
- Janq
As far as this earlier statement,
[The Taurus immediately comes to mind as an example, a fine car for the masses that has proven reliable.
/QUOTE]
Blingblingblue obviously never owned a Taurus. Those cars are more than notorious for the time spent in the transmission shop. My opinion of why sales went so far for them was because of the countless corp. who used them for fleet cars. My father owned a Taurus from '89-'99 changing to a new model every two years. We were able to drive a lot of different vehicles during this time period. Thanks to the leasing company who provided a rental for the months of time these "reliable tauruses" spent in the shop.
Domestics have a long way to come to be competetive in the car market. They own the truck market, and always will, but until they can build a quality car for the price that they do in the orient, I'll continue buying imports. [/B]
/QUOTE]
Blingblingblue obviously never owned a Taurus. Those cars are more than notorious for the time spent in the transmission shop. My opinion of why sales went so far for them was because of the countless corp. who used them for fleet cars. My father owned a Taurus from '89-'99 changing to a new model every two years. We were able to drive a lot of different vehicles during this time period. Thanks to the leasing company who provided a rental for the months of time these "reliable tauruses" spent in the shop.
Domestics have a long way to come to be competetive in the car market. They own the truck market, and always will, but until they can build a quality car for the price that they do in the orient, I'll continue buying imports. [/B]
I'm talking kicked in the family jewels with wooden clogs hurt.
Think about it. When is the last time you could rent a Honda Accord, or been pulled over by a BMW driving cop (not counting CA motorcops), or gone to school event in a Toyota Sienna, or hailed a cabbie driving a Camry or saw a public official driving around town with "GOVT USE ONLY" plates in an Avalon?
It just doesn't happen.
Now think of all the states, municiplaties and taxis and rental cars in the US alone. Yet some how GM & Ford will have you believe they are suffering due to unfair trade practices by imports.
Hmm...?!?
Meanwhile, Toyota, Honda, Subaru, Porsche (which is tiny!), Nissan, Mitsubishi, BMW, Mercedes, Hyundai, not even VAG (which Americans geberally seem to be okay with) requires a govt. handout to thrive and be succesfull on our shores. Oh, and they don't hand out 'buyers incentives', 'cash back financing', 'zero percent interest' or other product devaluing "deals" to convince/trick buyers into their showrooms. No they somehow get by on just fresh designs and quality product.
Dang, how do they do that?!
Well enough GM & Ford bashing.
I just wish they would get serious and catch up with the rest of the world. I mean for pete's sake Toyota is already going into v2.0 with its super cool electric-car 'Prius' (which is going to be a HUGE hit) while BMW has real hydrogen powered vehicles operating on the road. Heck, my '04 Honda Pilot SUV doesn't require a tune-up but once every _105,000_ miles as indicated in the owners manual!
I wonder how many tune-ups that '73 Ford has had in its 300K mile life. My Honda would have had three.
- Janq
04-23-2003, 04:01 PM
#26
I know it's just a nitpick (and I KNOW I don't have the time to get into an argument with Janq ) but Hertz does rent Camrys (along with the expected Ford'ed Jags, Volvos, and Mazdas), and either they or Avis have Accords as well.
That said, a high-level exec at Ford actually said on the record a few weeks ago that the Taurus isn't selling as well because "frankly, the Camry is a better car." He also said they made a mistake by giving so many to their Hertz subsidies - people started seeing the cars as a "drab rental car". Personally, if you take out Hertz they're still drab
Hold on...
Here's a link. I figured it made it enough headlines to be easy to find:
http://itd.colorado.edu/look5836/Rea...n%20Taurus.pdf
) but Hertz does rent Camrys (along with the expected Ford'ed Jags, Volvos, and Mazdas), and either they or Avis have Accords as well. That said, a high-level exec at Ford actually said on the record a few weeks ago that the Taurus isn't selling as well because "frankly, the Camry is a better car." He also said they made a mistake by giving so many to their Hertz subsidies - people started seeing the cars as a "drab rental car". Personally, if you take out Hertz they're still drab
Hold on...
Here's a link. I figured it made it enough headlines to be easy to find:
http://itd.colorado.edu/look5836/Rea...n%20Taurus.pdf
04-24-2003, 04:41 PM
#28
Guest
Posts: n/a
here's a reply from FORD that I got today asking about the Focus Cosworth. I was suprised at how fast they replied. Good customer service ...
Dear David,
Thank you for your message of 04/22/03 regarding the Ford Focus
Cosworth. We appreciate the time you have taken to write us inquiring
if there are any plans to bring this vehicle into the Canadian market.
Thank you for your interest in the Ford Focus Cosworth. Unfortunately,
there are no details at this time reflecting plans to put this vehicle
into commercial production in the Canadian market.
Ford Motor Company makes every effort to maintain a high standard of
quality control in our manufacturing process. We pride ourselves on
becoming the world's leading consumer company for automotive products
and services.
From time to time, vehicle models are added, deleted or modified.
Decisions to make these changes take into account factors such as market
trends, customer demands, engineering advances, and dealership input.
At the Customer Relationship Center, we are not notified in advance of
changes that our Engineering and Design Team may be making and the
specific reasons that the changes may be made in the future. We have
documented your interest in the Ford Focus Cosworth for future
consideration.
We value you as a customer, and should you have any other questions or
concerns, please feel free to contact us again as we would be happy to
assist you.
At Ford of Canada, we consider the satisfaction of our customers as one
of our most important objectives. If you have any other inquiries or
concerns, please feel free to contact us and we will be happy to address
them.
Thank you for contacting Ford of Canada.
Sincerely,
Simone
Ford Motor Company of Canada Ltd.
Customer Relationship Centre
Dear David,
Thank you for your message of 04/22/03 regarding the Ford Focus
Cosworth. We appreciate the time you have taken to write us inquiring
if there are any plans to bring this vehicle into the Canadian market.
Thank you for your interest in the Ford Focus Cosworth. Unfortunately,
there are no details at this time reflecting plans to put this vehicle
into commercial production in the Canadian market.
Ford Motor Company makes every effort to maintain a high standard of
quality control in our manufacturing process. We pride ourselves on
becoming the world's leading consumer company for automotive products
and services.
From time to time, vehicle models are added, deleted or modified.
Decisions to make these changes take into account factors such as market
trends, customer demands, engineering advances, and dealership input.
At the Customer Relationship Center, we are not notified in advance of
changes that our Engineering and Design Team may be making and the
specific reasons that the changes may be made in the future. We have
documented your interest in the Ford Focus Cosworth for future
consideration.
We value you as a customer, and should you have any other questions or
concerns, please feel free to contact us again as we would be happy to
assist you.
At Ford of Canada, we consider the satisfaction of our customers as one
of our most important objectives. If you have any other inquiries or
concerns, please feel free to contact us and we will be happy to address
them.
Thank you for contacting Ford of Canada.
Sincerely,
Simone
Ford Motor Company of Canada Ltd.
Customer Relationship Centre
04-24-2003, 04:56 PM
#29
Guest
Posts: n/a
No problems? Police cars blow up when hit. Ford is being sued night now by many police departments.
Originally posted by SpeedRacerWRX02
i rarely see and hear problems with taxi's and cop cars and what not.....made by ford and or GM.....hmm what does that tell u.
i rarely see and hear problems with taxi's and cop cars and what not.....made by ford and or GM.....hmm what does that tell u.
04-24-2003, 07:11 PM
#30
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally posted by Blue-Adept
No problems? Police cars blow up when hit. Ford is being sued night now by many police departments.
No problems? Police cars blow up when hit. Ford is being sued night now by many police departments.
SpeedRacerWRX02, I wonder how many cops & taxi drivers you know.
You should seek a few out and ask about the nicknames they use for reference to their 'Cruisers'. It won't be pleasant.
The same goes for hacks.
Ask around in the trade...you'll be surprised.
- Janq
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