Thank god my friend is alive (IRAQ incident)
10-14-2004, 05:19 PM
#16
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Glad your friend made it.
Was in Serbia and Kosovo and lost som buds there.Not the best time of my life, but it had to be done!
Was in Serbia and Kosovo and lost som buds there.Not the best time of my life, but it had to be done!
Last edited by Viking067; 10-14-2004 at 05:26 PM.
10-14-2004, 05:55 PM
#17
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Originally Posted by kitsune713
I'd just like to add that before this thread turns into another neverending political debacle. That we should not defer from the main topic and thank GOD (or whomever) that these brave men and women, like Jeff's friend, are comin' out of this mess alive.
Karl
Karl
Very true. My bad for my rant of a post, it's just that posts like stinger's erk me sometimes. Yes, what is MOST important here is that stg2s frind is okay, thank Jeebus.
-Chris
10-14-2004, 06:11 PM
#19
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Originally Posted by kitsune713
I'd just like to add that before this thread turns into another neverending political debacle. That we should not defer from the main topic and thank GOD (or whomever) that these brave men and women, like Jeff's friend, are comin' out of this mess alive.
Karl
Karl
We care so much about our own (as we should)... but give no consideration to the other side?
And another thing... I believe we should stop thanking and crediting 'god' for saving our troops. The truth is, they got lucky, period. Individually, I can see how someone's faith may be able to assist them in getting through hard times. But can't we learn anything from the obliviousness exhibited by terrorists who say their actions are in the name of 'god?' You might not think so, but I would assume, from your statement above, that god would also be responsible for all of the civilian casualties and 'unintentional' atrocites that have occured in that country.
Or is god only responsible for the good things that happen to us? ('us' being those who share our beliefs)
...thats what I thought.
I don't care if religion leads someone's life and everything they do. Making it public (especially for an elected official or world leader) is not the right thing to do, that is, unless one is trying to glamorize one belief system and place it above all others. Differences of opinion lead to conflict, it's that simple. This is one kind of opinion that should be kept to oneself. Outside of religious gatherings (where beliefs are more or less shared among one another), What other reason than to incite others or glamorize one's beliefs would one have for making one's faith public? We live in a world now where not everyone has the same system of beliefs and values. I think our president has failed to fully realize this, and in turn, he is oblivious to the effect his own public faith has on his ability to lead and be understood and respected in our own country, and around the world.
Sorry I had to pick on your quote here (you did say 'or whomever,' so I see that you already realize my point to some extent) ... it just reminded me of this and I've been waiting to vent.
How about a semi-relevant quote from George Carlin to lighten things up (opinion is respected among many
):"My god has a bigger d!ck than your god!"
(...showing the ridiculousness and pointlessness of religious conflict)
Moving on...
Our current president's strict belief and value system is out of the mainstream. I think that Bush is as far right as Kerry is left. As people have begun to become more aware of the world (with the internet, etc.) the mainstream itself, IMHO, has moved to the left. Liberal is not a bad thing to be. It does not connote radicalism (as some of you may think), it connotes open-mindedness and a wider view of the whole picture. This speaks to why Bush can talk so simply and straight forward to us. He is blind to, or simply refuses to acknowledge or give credence to any other points of view. Lots of people in this country would like to believe it's as simple as Bush says it is, and they are the same people who would refer to Kerry's words as 'complicated and misleading.' People need to open their minds and realize that were not in Kansas anymore. Bush has turned complicated issues into 'cut-and-dry,' easy to understand one-liners, mainly to fit them to how HE believes they should be. Things aren't as they should be, I just hope the public can see through Bush's simple-talk and see the real issues at hand. Four more years of this would only dig us deeper in the hole we sit in now- Can our country move toward being productive and altruistic when nearly the entire world HATES our leader? I just don't see how Bush could turn things around at this point. Kerry wouldn't have to turn things around, I think he's already headed in the right direction.
(Let the neverending political debacle begin!)
Last edited by scoobsport98; 10-15-2004 at 12:06 AM.
10-14-2004, 10:09 PM
#20
Originally Posted by bassplayrr
WMD's
Originally Posted by jeff
And lastly, if you've ever taken a Human Ecology class which I have, you should know why these "tree huggers" are so concerned, they're trying to look out for the lives of everybody just like Bush wants to protect us with the armed forces.
Originally Posted by Jeff
Hmm, let me see here. Last time my friend was on leave he brought home his laptop with 1000+ photos from over there and spent hours on end discussing the situation on more than one occasion. I guess I'm just totally clueless about the whole ordeal right?
10-14-2004, 10:22 PM
#21
[/QUOTE=Scooby]
Moving on...
Bush has turned complicated issues into 'cut-and-dry,' easy to understand one-liners, mainly to fit them to how HE believes they should be. Things aren't as they should be, I just hope the public can see through Bush's simple-talk and see the real issues at hand. Four more years of this would only dig us deeper in the hole we sit in now-
(Let the neverending political debacle begin!)[/QUOTE]
dig us deeper? im sorry but when put in the situation our president was in the hole was dug from the beginning... ANY ****ing president or leader put in charge when the cards were delt this way is already behind the power curve, the terrorist attacks on 9/11 sparked a chain reaction where terrorism became priority #1, the environment, childcare, and whatever the hell else you want to ***** about what isn't going smoothly is behind it. the dot com boom was already at its peak and was going downhill from the getgo, BUSH is not to blame for why the economy isn't thriving ( referring to the hole we sit in now ). Anyone put in charge at that time would have taken some sort of military action in some way or another. WE DO NOT KNOW all the facts, everyone keeps saying BUSH WENT INTO WAR KNOWING NOTHING... HE"S THE ****ING PRESIDENT you think he doesn't have all the information at his fingertips? IM SORRY PPL but this is the #1 country in the world... he made his decisions accordingly...
there will always be people who will be right in their hypothesis about how the war should be delegated and what moves to make... those retired generals who come out and say " bush didn't go in with enough troops" will of course come out if they are correct, but lets say we got the job done somehow with 80% of the troops we needed? NO one will hear about those ppl who said we need more troops... because its irrelevant...
The media will always exagerrate and exploit any information which sounds bad and catchy, and sadly you all gobble it up...
lastly Jeff, you should be glad that stupid marine recruit thinks the way he does, because if he was a scared whining baby, would you rather have him defending you in Iraq??
Moving on...
Bush has turned complicated issues into 'cut-and-dry,' easy to understand one-liners, mainly to fit them to how HE believes they should be. Things aren't as they should be, I just hope the public can see through Bush's simple-talk and see the real issues at hand. Four more years of this would only dig us deeper in the hole we sit in now-
(Let the neverending political debacle begin!)[/QUOTE]
dig us deeper? im sorry but when put in the situation our president was in the hole was dug from the beginning... ANY ****ing president or leader put in charge when the cards were delt this way is already behind the power curve, the terrorist attacks on 9/11 sparked a chain reaction where terrorism became priority #1, the environment, childcare, and whatever the hell else you want to ***** about what isn't going smoothly is behind it. the dot com boom was already at its peak and was going downhill from the getgo, BUSH is not to blame for why the economy isn't thriving ( referring to the hole we sit in now ). Anyone put in charge at that time would have taken some sort of military action in some way or another. WE DO NOT KNOW all the facts, everyone keeps saying BUSH WENT INTO WAR KNOWING NOTHING... HE"S THE ****ING PRESIDENT you think he doesn't have all the information at his fingertips? IM SORRY PPL but this is the #1 country in the world... he made his decisions accordingly...
there will always be people who will be right in their hypothesis about how the war should be delegated and what moves to make... those retired generals who come out and say " bush didn't go in with enough troops" will of course come out if they are correct, but lets say we got the job done somehow with 80% of the troops we needed? NO one will hear about those ppl who said we need more troops... because its irrelevant...
The media will always exagerrate and exploit any information which sounds bad and catchy, and sadly you all gobble it up...
lastly Jeff, you should be glad that stupid marine recruit thinks the way he does, because if he was a scared whining baby, would you rather have him defending you in Iraq??
10-14-2004, 10:24 PM
#22
lastly
you bringing up the environment like i dont know wtf is going on is stupid... your part of a car club which 75%+ run catless... PLZ gtfo outta here if your gonna come at me with something like that, the environemtn isn't a big priority to the ppl who drive modified cars... im sorry, but the truth is... if we could run 100+ octane for $1.50 a gallon and run catless without any penalties /consequences, guess what... we all would
10-14-2004, 10:38 PM
#23
Originally Posted by SsTiNgEr77
what do you say to the beheadings of americans on TV? what do you say to the mutilation of the bodies of those american contractors?
There wouldn't be any Americans there if it wasn't for the war.
10-14-2004, 11:00 PM
#24
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Originally Posted by scoobsport98
We care so much about our own (as we should)... but give no consideration to the other side?
And another thing... I believe we should stop thanking and crediting 'god' for saving our troops. The truth is, they got lucky, period. Individually, someone's faith may be able to assist them in getting. Can't we learn anything from the obliviousness exhibited by terrorists who say their actions are in the name of 'god?' You might not think so, but I would assume, from your statement above, that god would also be responsible for all of the civilian casualties and 'unintentional' atrocites that have occured in that country.
Or is god only responsible for the good things that happen to us? ('us' being those who share our beliefs)
...thats what I thought.
I don't care if religion leads someone's life and everything they do. Making it public (especially for an elected official or world leader) is not the right thing to do, that is, unless one is trying to glamorize one belief system and place it above all others. Differences of opinion lead to conflict, it's that simple. This is one kind of opinion that should be kept to oneself. Outside of religious gatherings (where beliefs are more or less shared among one another), What other reason than to incite others or glamorize one's beliefs would one have for making one's faith public? We live in a world now where not everyone has the same system of beliefs and values. I think our president has failed to fully realize this, and in turn, he is oblivious to the effect his own public faith has on his ability to lead and be understood and respected in our own country, and around the world.
Sorry I had to pick on your quote here (you did say 'or whomever,' so I see that you already realize my point to some extent) ... it just reminded me of this and I've been waiting to vent.
How about a semi-relevant quote from George Carlin to lighten things up (opinion is respected among many ):
"My god has a bigger d!ck than your god!"
(...showing the ridiculousness and pointlessness of religious conflict)
Moving on...
Our current president's strict belief and value system is out of the mainstream. I think that Bush is as far right as Kerry is left. As people have begun to become more aware of the world (with the internet, etc.) the mainstream itself, IMHO, has moved to the left. Liberal is not a bad thing to be. It does not connote radicalism (as some of you may think), it connotes open-mindedness and a wider view of the whole picture. This speaks to why Bush can talk so simply and straight forward to us. He is blind to, or simply refuses to acknowledge or give credence to any other points of view. Lots of people in this country would like to believe it's as simple as Bush says it is, and they are the same people who would refer to Kerry's words as 'complicated and misleading.' People need to open their minds and realize that were not in Kansas anymore. Bush has turned complicated issues into 'cut-and-dry,' easy to understand one-liners, mainly to fit them to how HE believes they should be. Things aren't as they should be, I just hope the public can see through Bush's simple-talk and see the real issues at hand. Four more years of this would only dig us deeper in the hole we sit in now- Can our country move toward being productive and altruistic when nearly the entire world HATES our leader? I just don't see how Bush could turn things around at this point. Kerry wouldn't have to turn things around, I think he's already headed in the right direction.
(Let the neverending political debacle begin!)
And another thing... I believe we should stop thanking and crediting 'god' for saving our troops. The truth is, they got lucky, period. Individually, someone's faith may be able to assist them in getting. Can't we learn anything from the obliviousness exhibited by terrorists who say their actions are in the name of 'god?' You might not think so, but I would assume, from your statement above, that god would also be responsible for all of the civilian casualties and 'unintentional' atrocites that have occured in that country.
Or is god only responsible for the good things that happen to us? ('us' being those who share our beliefs)
...thats what I thought.
I don't care if religion leads someone's life and everything they do. Making it public (especially for an elected official or world leader) is not the right thing to do, that is, unless one is trying to glamorize one belief system and place it above all others. Differences of opinion lead to conflict, it's that simple. This is one kind of opinion that should be kept to oneself. Outside of religious gatherings (where beliefs are more or less shared among one another), What other reason than to incite others or glamorize one's beliefs would one have for making one's faith public? We live in a world now where not everyone has the same system of beliefs and values. I think our president has failed to fully realize this, and in turn, he is oblivious to the effect his own public faith has on his ability to lead and be understood and respected in our own country, and around the world.
Sorry I had to pick on your quote here (you did say 'or whomever,' so I see that you already realize my point to some extent) ... it just reminded me of this and I've been waiting to vent.
How about a semi-relevant quote from George Carlin to lighten things up (opinion is respected among many
):"My god has a bigger d!ck than your god!"
(...showing the ridiculousness and pointlessness of religious conflict)
Moving on...
Our current president's strict belief and value system is out of the mainstream. I think that Bush is as far right as Kerry is left. As people have begun to become more aware of the world (with the internet, etc.) the mainstream itself, IMHO, has moved to the left. Liberal is not a bad thing to be. It does not connote radicalism (as some of you may think), it connotes open-mindedness and a wider view of the whole picture. This speaks to why Bush can talk so simply and straight forward to us. He is blind to, or simply refuses to acknowledge or give credence to any other points of view. Lots of people in this country would like to believe it's as simple as Bush says it is, and they are the same people who would refer to Kerry's words as 'complicated and misleading.' People need to open their minds and realize that were not in Kansas anymore. Bush has turned complicated issues into 'cut-and-dry,' easy to understand one-liners, mainly to fit them to how HE believes they should be. Things aren't as they should be, I just hope the public can see through Bush's simple-talk and see the real issues at hand. Four more years of this would only dig us deeper in the hole we sit in now- Can our country move toward being productive and altruistic when nearly the entire world HATES our leader? I just don't see how Bush could turn things around at this point. Kerry wouldn't have to turn things around, I think he's already headed in the right direction.
(Let the neverending political debacle begin!)
There is some good logic. For once, someone who's intelligent, and has a open mind, and itsn't just spitting bigotry, and opinions with no real base.
<<Continue>>
10-14-2004, 11:10 PM
#25
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Glad to hear your friend is out of harms way.
Hopefully he'll get 100% disability from Uncle Sam. Tell him to really push that because I could only get 10% for substantial loss of hearing when others were getting 30% for a stutter. Seriously.
Hopefully he'll get 100% disability from Uncle Sam. Tell him to really push that because I could only get 10% for substantial loss of hearing when others were getting 30% for a stutter. Seriously.
Last edited by Salty; 10-14-2004 at 11:12 PM.
10-14-2004, 11:36 PM
#27
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Originally Posted by SsTiNgEr77
dig us deeper? im sorry but when put in the situation our president was in the hole was dug from the beginning... ANY ****ing president or leader put in charge when the cards were delt this way is already behind the power curve, the terrorist attacks on 9/11 sparked a chain reaction where terrorism became priority #1, the environment, childcare, and whatever the hell else you want to ***** about what isn't going smoothly is behind it. the dot com boom was already at its peak and was going downhill from the getgo, BUSH is not to blame for why the economy isn't thriving ( referring to the hole we sit in now ). Anyone put in charge at that time would have taken some sort of military action in some way or another. WE DO NOT KNOW all the facts, everyone keeps saying BUSH WENT INTO WAR KNOWING NOTHING... HE"S THE ****ING PRESIDENT you think he doesn't have all the information at his fingertips? IM SORRY PPL but this is the #1 country in the world... he made his decisions accordingly...
there will always be people who will be right in their hypothesis about how the war should be delegated and what moves to make... those retired generals who come out and say " bush didn't go in with enough troops" will of course come out if they are correct, but lets say we got the job done somehow with 80% of the troops we needed? NO one will hear about those ppl who said we need more troops... because its irrelevant...
The media will always exagerrate and exploit any information which sounds bad and catchy, and sadly you all gobble it up...
lastly Jeff, you should be glad that stupid marine recruit thinks the way he does, because if he was a scared whining baby, would you rather have him defending you in Iraq??
10-14-2004, 11:46 PM
#29
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Our great Vice President is the very person who was working with Saddam in the 80s, giving him the WMD he HAD, and the gas to use against Iran. These are historical events, things that cannot be debated, due to their utter reality. These things happened, and they are now public (within 5-6 Years), but were not 10-15 years ago.
The "lesser of two evils" is not a logical explanation of how we helped him gain so much power in the 80s, only to invade in the early 90s to stop his advance against/into Kuwait AND again in 2003 to remove him from power... The same seat that we helped him create in the 80s with his fight against Iran.
The "lesser of two evils" is not a logical explanation of how we helped him gain so much power in the 80s, only to invade in the early 90s to stop his advance against/into Kuwait AND again in 2003 to remove him from power... The same seat that we helped him create in the 80s with his fight against Iran.
10-14-2004, 11:48 PM
#30
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Stinger,
Hint: If you put some substance into your arguments, they would be much more effective.
Your responses to Jeff's quotes not only didn't aptly apply to what he had to say, I think they shows shades of the same ignorance that plagues our current administration. I hope the average voter is a little better informed than you.
EDIT:
Now that I read your rambling response to my post, I can only laugh. I'd like to take some time and pick apart the farse you are spewing, but I have a damn midterm tomorrow and need to study.
and Joltdude... nice to see that somebody appreciates (and seems to share) my point of view. As I scrolled down and noticed you quoted my whole post, I was preparing for some more flaming from dead-set (read:close-minded) Bushbackers. Not judging from who posted, I'm just getting used to it here.
Hint: If you put some substance into your arguments, they would be much more effective.
Your responses to Jeff's quotes not only didn't aptly apply to what he had to say, I think they shows shades of the same ignorance that plagues our current administration. I hope the average voter is a little better informed than you.
EDIT:
Now that I read your rambling response to my post, I can only laugh. I'd like to take some time and pick apart the farse you are spewing, but I have a damn midterm tomorrow and need to study.
and Joltdude... nice to see that somebody appreciates (and seems to share) my point of view. As I scrolled down and noticed you quoted my whole post, I was preparing for some more flaming from dead-set (read:close-minded) Bushbackers. Not judging from who posted, I'm just getting used to it here.
Last edited by scoobsport98; 10-15-2004 at 12:02 AM.