law about openig your hood?
09-05-2003, 04:52 PM
#31
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Originally posted by BADWRX
Federal Cop? How about a cookie cop? MP's are kinda Federal I guess you could say.
Sisqocqk:
TS SCI (Top Secret Secured Compartmental Information) is the highest clearance we can have in the service. I am not familiar with the Q clearance.
Federal Cop? How about a cookie cop? MP's are kinda Federal I guess you could say.
Sisqocqk:
TS SCI (Top Secret Secured Compartmental Information) is the highest clearance we can have in the service. I am not familiar with the Q clearance.
just an older term that came from the 60's everyone i was around used because it was easier (infantry guys didn't like difficult thinks..hell we had trouble with our names). It's same exact clearance. It was a buddy of mine that was with PSYOP's (3rd POG ABN) out of ft. bragg who was linked with CAG.
i just had a secret clearance because of a few schools i went to and because i had to know how to opperate a lot of different radios that were 'secret' in the army's eyes.
09-05-2003, 05:20 PM
#32
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if you have modified your car (cold air ect.) then they have the right to make sure everything complies with all of the laws and stuff. If you refuse they have the right to tow your car. Good Luck
WRX Rush
WRX Rush
09-05-2003, 06:10 PM
#33
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Speaking as a current Captain in the Army Reserves (MI), and having been a former CI Agent (97B for you Army types 
), I'm quite familiar with what can and can't get your clearance yanked... in fact, I am quite familiar with the entire world of security clearances. In 13 years, the only people I've ever run into that used the term "Q Clearance" were the crusty old warrants who have been in since the 60s . These days, we use TS/SCI. Nice to see some fellow green suiters on the boards.
The official US military policy says that a random urinalysis can be administered once a year, or more often depending on circumstances (yes, poppy seeds will show you hot, as well as quite a few medicines that are opiate derivatives). A conviction of ANY SORT can be grounds for termination of clearance, but it all depends on what you do, etc. It's quite common for a TS/SCI to be downgraded to a Secret clearance simply on the Commander's perogative. If a CO decides that you don't deserve it, he has clearance suspension authority. In other words, even though CCF is the one that grants your clearance, a CO can and will yank your access and clearance should you screw up sufficiently. I've also seen TS/SCI clearances get downgraded for breaking numerous rules you would be surprised about, like marrying a foreign national, which automatically downgrades your clearance to Secret, and yanks all access to SCI programs. A DUI is an instant downgrade. It's quite funny how hard it is to get your TS/SCI, and how easy it is to lose it. I think I'm on my 3rd renewal of my clearance, and it doesn't get any easier.
I'm also quite familiar with the search and seizure rules, both civilian and military (again, part of the CI thing, as well as being a Legal Studies major at Cal), and refusal to search is NOT admission of guilt. However, there are quite a few less rules protecting you when you are in your car than when you are at home. The rule of thumb is, a person does not have an expectation of privacy when in his vehicle. Let's also not forget the "plain sight" rule, that says that an officer can develop probable cause if there is something illegal "in plain sight." The list goes on and on, and covers many aspects of law, from search and seizure laws, to right to privacy, etc.
There are several court cases that make vehicular searches incident to a traffic stop legal. The so-called Terry Stop rule, from the case "Terry v. Ohio", http://www.fletc.gov/legal/ARCHIVES.pdf , gives law enforcement personnel such an ability. A law enforcement officer may initiate a Terry stop when he or she suspects that an individual is committing, has committed, or is about to commit a crime, but probable cause does not yet exist to arrest and the officer wants to “stop” the suspect and investigate. If, during the stop, probable cause to arrest is developed, the suspect will be arrested. If probable cause is not developed, the suspect is released. So, if a cop stops you for a moving infraction, and decides that he may want to detain you for whatever reason, he has the legal precedent to do so.
In others words, if a cop asks you if he can search your vehicle, there is nothing wrong with saying "Officer, respectfully, please tell me by what probably cause you are requesting the right to search my vehicle." If he tells you something serious enough, you can bet that he WILL get the bench warrant to search your vehicle, but don't just give up any of your right to refuse. Otherwise, you can politely say, "Officer, respectfully, I decline to give you permission to search my vehicle." Don't ever get angry, annoyed, raise your voice, or act anything other than professional and courteous. He's doing a job. Remember, if he feels strongly enough to call for that bench warrant, he probably feels that he has enough to get one, because it's his *** if he is wrong.
You may want to check www.ticketassassin.com for some useful information, as well. Their advice on how to act to avoid getting a ticket hold just as well for refusing a request to search your vehicle.
shadowcat, who knows just enough to be dangerous, but is not a lawyer.
), I'm quite familiar with what can and can't get your clearance yanked... in fact, I am quite familiar with the entire world of security clearances. In 13 years, the only people I've ever run into that used the term "Q Clearance" were the crusty old warrants who have been in since the 60s . These days, we use TS/SCI. Nice to see some fellow green suiters on the boards.The official US military policy says that a random urinalysis can be administered once a year, or more often depending on circumstances (yes, poppy seeds will show you hot, as well as quite a few medicines that are opiate derivatives). A conviction of ANY SORT can be grounds for termination of clearance, but it all depends on what you do, etc. It's quite common for a TS/SCI to be downgraded to a Secret clearance simply on the Commander's perogative. If a CO decides that you don't deserve it, he has clearance suspension authority. In other words, even though CCF is the one that grants your clearance, a CO can and will yank your access and clearance should you screw up sufficiently. I've also seen TS/SCI clearances get downgraded for breaking numerous rules you would be surprised about, like marrying a foreign national, which automatically downgrades your clearance to Secret, and yanks all access to SCI programs. A DUI is an instant downgrade. It's quite funny how hard it is to get your TS/SCI, and how easy it is to lose it. I think I'm on my 3rd renewal of my clearance, and it doesn't get any easier.
I'm also quite familiar with the search and seizure rules, both civilian and military (again, part of the CI thing, as well as being a Legal Studies major at Cal), and refusal to search is NOT admission of guilt. However, there are quite a few less rules protecting you when you are in your car than when you are at home. The rule of thumb is, a person does not have an expectation of privacy when in his vehicle. Let's also not forget the "plain sight" rule, that says that an officer can develop probable cause if there is something illegal "in plain sight." The list goes on and on, and covers many aspects of law, from search and seizure laws, to right to privacy, etc.
There are several court cases that make vehicular searches incident to a traffic stop legal. The so-called Terry Stop rule, from the case "Terry v. Ohio", http://www.fletc.gov/legal/ARCHIVES.pdf , gives law enforcement personnel such an ability. A law enforcement officer may initiate a Terry stop when he or she suspects that an individual is committing, has committed, or is about to commit a crime, but probable cause does not yet exist to arrest and the officer wants to “stop” the suspect and investigate. If, during the stop, probable cause to arrest is developed, the suspect will be arrested. If probable cause is not developed, the suspect is released. So, if a cop stops you for a moving infraction, and decides that he may want to detain you for whatever reason, he has the legal precedent to do so.
In others words, if a cop asks you if he can search your vehicle, there is nothing wrong with saying "Officer, respectfully, please tell me by what probably cause you are requesting the right to search my vehicle." If he tells you something serious enough, you can bet that he WILL get the bench warrant to search your vehicle, but don't just give up any of your right to refuse. Otherwise, you can politely say, "Officer, respectfully, I decline to give you permission to search my vehicle." Don't ever get angry, annoyed, raise your voice, or act anything other than professional and courteous. He's doing a job. Remember, if he feels strongly enough to call for that bench warrant, he probably feels that he has enough to get one, because it's his *** if he is wrong.
You may want to check www.ticketassassin.com for some useful information, as well. Their advice on how to act to avoid getting a ticket hold just as well for refusing a request to search your vehicle.
shadowcat, who knows just enough to be dangerous, but is not a lawyer.
Last edited by shadowcat; 09-05-2003 at 06:17 PM.
09-05-2003, 09:46 PM
#34
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Originally posted by shadowcat
Nice to see some fellow green suiters on the boards.
Nice to see some fellow green suiters on the boards.
Originally posted by shadowcat
I've also seen TS/SCI clearances get downgraded for breaking numerous rules you would be surprised about, like marrying a foreign national, which automatically downgrades your clearance to Secret, and yanks all access to SCI programs.
I've also seen TS/SCI clearances get downgraded for breaking numerous rules you would be surprised about, like marrying a foreign national, which automatically downgrades your clearance to Secret, and yanks all access to SCI programs.
Other countries, like the P. I. and Japan, and England, Australia, and all the allied nations is on a case by case basis. I know, I had to research it and get approval before marrying my wife (She is a Japanese National).
09-05-2003, 10:36 PM
#35
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LOl..... my dads a cop and some of the stories here about cop tricks is _ S. wad of paper towel LOL 
..
They will tow your a$$ if you dont open the hood period.
my 2 real cents
..They will tow your a$$ if you dont open the hood period.
my 2 real cents
09-06-2003, 01:08 AM
#36
Originally posted by ginowrx
LOl..... my dads a cop and some of the stories here about cop tricks is _ S. wad of paper towel LOL..
They will tow your a$$ if you dont open the hood period.
my 2 real cents
LOl..... my dads a cop and some of the stories here about cop tricks is _ S. wad of paper towel LOL
..They will tow your a$$ if you dont open the hood period.
my 2 real cents
Getting towed is a damned good reason to swallow the stinkin' "modified exhaust" ticket. If you don't though, just make sure they use dollies
09-06-2003, 02:10 AM
#37
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If a cop asks to pop your hood just say 'Id rather not officer.' Just be polite and if youre lucky maybe they wont act like a complete dick about it.
Ex-ricer are you a marshal or something?
Ex-ricer are you a marshal or something?
09-06-2003, 01:43 PM
#39
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lol no im not a marshall. BADWRX had it right lol were like wanna be cops. US Air Force Security Forces Report and Analysis dept. i use the federal cop thing to get outta tickets (which has worked more then a few times i assure you ) and we like to make ourselves feel important we do go to an academy where we learn the same stuff as federal cops and ive been to city cop schools like ASP, OC, and a EST school once. we also learn state laws etc dealin with the more pertinent PC and VCs. didnt mean to be misleading but calling us Military Police lumps us in with the Army and Navy MPs and we do so much more 
josh
) and we like to make ourselves feel important we do go to an academy where we learn the same stuff as federal cops and ive been to city cop schools like ASP, OC, and a EST school once. we also learn state laws etc dealin with the more pertinent PC and VCs. didnt mean to be misleading but calling us Military Police lumps us in with the Army and Navy MPs and we do so much more josh
09-06-2003, 02:24 PM
#40
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I think the key is just having a little tact.
If asked to open your hood, you ask if the officer is asking to search your vehicle.
Sometimes that alone is enough for him to forget about it (he may realize you know what you are doing and he doesn't have probable cause).
If he says he wants to check for violations, you can say something like, "That isn't necessary and I wouldn't want you to waste your time or get dirty."
Again he may give up simply because you are thinking of him and calm, and a swell person.
You can add "but if you really want to" if you are gonna let him.
You can ask him what he is interested in looking for under the hood.
If he says "Cold air Intake and other illegal intake mods" and you don't have those, tell him.
"I don't have any of those or even know what they are, officer."
You can also speak first and say "Well I don't have a turbo upgrade, cold air intake, ram intake, supercharger, headers, nitrous mods or any of that crap, but if you really want to look, you are welcome to."
Or not.
If it comes down to it, you have the right to deny search, period.
They can not arrest for denying search.
You just don't want to be suspicious about denying it.
Get them to tell you what they are looking for, tell them you don't have any of that and so you must refuse to let them waste their time and search under your hood.
"I only have body styling mods, and nice rims.
I'm not into that other crap.
I don't even have neon.
Why are you picking on me?
It seems like you are looking for an excuse to give me a ticket, when clearly
I wasn't speeding and your radar gun
being in POP mode (which is known to be
unreliable) isn't even admissible in court
since it doesn't lock the speed.
Did I mention my dad owns a law firm?
I just met this guy Steve, he is a CHP too,
he says even you guys have bad days and
sometimes take it out on innocent people.
He said HE would never write a bogus
ticket though, even if he hated someone.
Still it scares me.
You scare me.
I feel threatened.
Here I am a law abiding citizen that pays
taxes and votes and you, officer,
who are supposed to be there to help
when there is crime or problems,
is out to give me a ticket for no reason,
and with people speeding by us while you
dilly dally around looking for some minor fix it violation
- wow did you see that Honda fly by?
He even had neon and must've been going 20 over!
In the interest of getting you back on the
job catching the bad guys, I've decided to
let you look under the hood, since it will
probably take less time for you to check
out my stock engine, that it does to get
you to believe the truth."
If asked to open your hood, you ask if the officer is asking to search your vehicle.
Sometimes that alone is enough for him to forget about it (he may realize you know what you are doing and he doesn't have probable cause).
If he says he wants to check for violations, you can say something like, "That isn't necessary and I wouldn't want you to waste your time or get dirty."
Again he may give up simply because you are thinking of him and calm, and a swell person.
You can add "but if you really want to" if you are gonna let him.
You can ask him what he is interested in looking for under the hood.
If he says "Cold air Intake and other illegal intake mods" and you don't have those, tell him.
"I don't have any of those or even know what they are, officer."
You can also speak first and say "Well I don't have a turbo upgrade, cold air intake, ram intake, supercharger, headers, nitrous mods or any of that crap, but if you really want to look, you are welcome to."
Or not.
If it comes down to it, you have the right to deny search, period.
They can not arrest for denying search.
You just don't want to be suspicious about denying it.
Get them to tell you what they are looking for, tell them you don't have any of that and so you must refuse to let them waste their time and search under your hood.
"I only have body styling mods, and nice rims.
I'm not into that other crap.
I don't even have neon.
Why are you picking on me?
It seems like you are looking for an excuse to give me a ticket, when clearly
I wasn't speeding and your radar gun
being in POP mode (which is known to be
unreliable) isn't even admissible in court
since it doesn't lock the speed.
Did I mention my dad owns a law firm?
I just met this guy Steve, he is a CHP too,
he says even you guys have bad days and
sometimes take it out on innocent people.
He said HE would never write a bogus
ticket though, even if he hated someone.
Still it scares me.
You scare me.
I feel threatened.
Here I am a law abiding citizen that pays
taxes and votes and you, officer,
who are supposed to be there to help
when there is crime or problems,
is out to give me a ticket for no reason,
and with people speeding by us while you
dilly dally around looking for some minor fix it violation
- wow did you see that Honda fly by?
He even had neon and must've been going 20 over!
In the interest of getting you back on the
job catching the bad guys, I've decided to
let you look under the hood, since it will
probably take less time for you to check
out my stock engine, that it does to get
you to believe the truth."
Last edited by mikkyo; 09-06-2003 at 05:06 PM.
09-06-2003, 09:21 PM
#41
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So how many people here aren't sleeping good now knowing that you're one hood latch away from the dumbest laws known to man?Oh well it's the price we pay for wanting to play!
If I get asked to pop my hood I'll just bend over and relax and all I've got is Vinster's old Blitz intake and a BOV!
If I get asked to pop my hood I'll just bend over and relax and all I've got is Vinster's old Blitz intake and a BOV!
09-07-2003, 12:51 PM
#42
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Originally posted by BADWRX
Federal Cop? How about a cookie cop? MP's are kinda Federal I guess you could say.
Sisqocqk:
TS SCI (Top Secret Secured Compartmental Information) is the highest clearance we can have in the service. I am not familiar with the Q clearance.
Federal Cop? How about a cookie cop? MP's are kinda Federal I guess you could say.
Sisqocqk:
TS SCI (Top Secret Secured Compartmental Information) is the highest clearance we can have in the service. I am not familiar with the Q clearance.
Last edited by AntiochCali; 09-07-2003 at 01:04 PM.
09-07-2003, 12:58 PM
#43
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Originally posted by mikkyo
I think the key is just having a little tact.
...If it comes down to it, you have the right to deny search, period.
They can not arrest for denying search.
You just don't want to be suspicious about denying it...
I think the key is just having a little tact.
...If it comes down to it, you have the right to deny search, period.
They can not arrest for denying search.
You just don't want to be suspicious about denying it...
He told me the reason he didn't want to sign was because he didn't want the dog on his leather seats.
The cops will probably not try and get a warrant, judges generally aren't pushovers for street cops, but they can hold you up for hours, till the end of their shift I guess, asking for your permission.
09-07-2003, 02:37 PM
#44
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I have only been pulled over once!!! Why? I don't know, maybe my black rex is just too slick for them piggies. I got pulled over for illegal lane change (he said I passed someone in the 2 way turning lane). I just about sh*t my pants cuz I was really stoned. He first asked if I would pop my hood for him, I said "uhm... no." He said okay and walked back to his bike. 15 MINUTES LATER he walks back up to my car "It took me a while to find out what to write you up for" and gave me the ticket. I was like uhh okay see you in court buddy (just thinking, didn't actually say it). He gave me a weird look and asked if he can take a look in my car. I was like "No sir you already have used enough of my precious time." I was pulled over for 25 freakin minutes for something I DIDNT DO AHHH!!! I HATE PIGS!! 
PIGS!
-rob
sorry i dont like law enforcement much.
PIGS!-rob
sorry i dont like law enforcement much.