Anyone ever train at Charles Gracie's gym in Daly City and/or the S.F. Judo Institute
10-13-2005, 01:48 PM
#31
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I was mostly speaking of guys that do not have any type of formal training, and would not know how to defend against a smaller person with fighting skills..
But, I do know that skill to skill, larger individuals do have some advangtage over others. Not saying everyone is as good as the real "Bruce Lee", but that just goes to show....If you are smaller and know your stuff, you are a threat.......
But, I do know that skill to skill, larger individuals do have some advangtage over others. Not saying everyone is as good as the real "Bruce Lee", but that just goes to show....If you are smaller and know your stuff, you are a threat.......
10-13-2005, 09:57 PM
#32
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Originally Posted by Choku Dori
leftwo: more good info! BTW, did I see that there are judo courses on the Charles Gracie website? If so, I guess that would take care of hard takedowns
just when the judo guy comes to train and feels like it. If you really want
just judo, then you should probably look elsewhere
Originally Posted by Choku Dori
As for UFC, I've been a little behind. Been renting Pride videos instead haha. I guess it's approaching the latter part of the season for the Ultimate Fighter so I'll tune in again. Last season was the same: lame fights early on and some real wars towards the end. Was anyone else disappointed at how lame Jorge was a few weeks ago? 
been some crappy fights so far this season too. Jorge was a let down, I was
expecting more of him for sure.
10-13-2005, 10:14 PM
#33
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Johnp, you bring up some good points. Let me put on my Jiu-Jitsu hat and
talk about your story
I agree with you here, and the point is this. Technique can win over strength,
but only to a certain point. And if the stronger person also knows some
technique, then the smaller guy may even have less of a chance. I think what
started this was in the beginning the jiu-jitsu guys would say that it did not
matter how big and strong you were, that the better jiu-jitsu guy would always
win. I think we all know now that this is not true.
And your probably right. There are techniques that are "just for jiu-jitsu".
I agree that this is not the best move to try in a street fight.
Let me stop you right here. He was in your guard and trying to choke you??
He must not be a very good brown belt. One of the basic rules of jiu-jitsu is
to get position first, then execute submission. Trying to submit someone
from inside their guard is, well, stupid.
I agree with all this. Technique can only take you so far. In the beginning they
did not have weight classes in the UFC. But it can only go that way for so long
before the stronger guys figure out how to fight. Sure a smaller guy always has
a chance to "catch" the bigger guy, but 9 times out of 10, if the technique level
is close, I'm going to put my money on the bigger guy.
talk about your story
Originally Posted by jonp
It's not that the big guys think they don't need to know how to fight, it's that they can still win when the other guy knows what they're doing.
but only to a certain point. And if the stronger person also knows some
technique, then the smaller guy may even have less of a chance. I think what
started this was in the beginning the jiu-jitsu guys would say that it did not
matter how big and strong you were, that the better jiu-jitsu guy would always
win. I think we all know now that this is not true.
Originally Posted by jonp
I've practiced a few different arts, and whenever I would go to a new dojo there were always "senior" students that would think they are going to show the big guy a lesson with their superior technique. I did a trial membership at a BJJ school where I went to school in Chico, CA when something like this happend to me. One of the brown belt students was trying to show me a lapel choke that I wasn't too convinced would work in a street fight on someone stronger than you.
I agree that this is not the best move to try in a street fight.
Originally Posted by jonp
We started with him in my guard and when he grabbed onto my shirt and tried to twist it
He must not be a very good brown belt. One of the basic rules of jiu-jitsu is
to get position first, then execute submission. Trying to submit someone
from inside their guard is, well, stupid.
Originally Posted by jonp
I first put my thumb on his eye and said I should rip it out, and then I just pulled one of his arms up and arm barred him out. I was so much stronger than him, that he couldn't pull his arm away. Being almost twice as strong as someone in a grappling fight can help you a lot if the other person isn't carefull. Certain techniques don't work very well, and certain positions you end up in aren't always an ok place to be. I've seen a lot of bigger BJJ students roll someone from their guard into a full mount just because their legs we so long and strong. The guy in their guard couldn't do much about it, if they tried to stand up they were pulled down with strength and head control, if they put their arm or legs to the side they would get a few strikes upside the head or just be over powered.
I think situations like this are why so many people like to cross train. In every art there are certain techniques that just look and feel really weak. I would never want to try a frontal lapel choke on someone in a street fight. I'd just use striking and elbow or punch them in the face: no gloves = more cuts and facial damage.
I think situations like this are why so many people like to cross train. In every art there are certain techniques that just look and feel really weak. I would never want to try a frontal lapel choke on someone in a street fight. I'd just use striking and elbow or punch them in the face: no gloves = more cuts and facial damage.
did not have weight classes in the UFC. But it can only go that way for so long
before the stronger guys figure out how to fight. Sure a smaller guy always has
a chance to "catch" the bigger guy, but 9 times out of 10, if the technique level
is close, I'm going to put my money on the bigger guy.
10-14-2005, 10:28 AM
#34
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Originally Posted by leftwo
Johnp, you bring up some good points. Let me put on my Jiu-Jitsu hat and
talk about your story
I agree with you here, and the point is this. Technique can win over strength,
but only to a certain point. And if the stronger person also knows some
technique, then the smaller guy may even have less of a chance. I think what
started this was in the beginning the jiu-jitsu guys would say that it did not
matter how big and strong you were, that the better jiu-jitsu guy would always
win. I think we all know now that this is not true.
And your probably right. There are techniques that are "just for jiu-jitsu".
I agree that this is not the best move to try in a street fight.
Let me stop you right here. He was in your guard and trying to choke you??
He must not be a very good brown belt. One of the basic rules of jiu-jitsu is
to get position first, then execute submission. Trying to submit someone
from inside their guard is, well, stupid.
I agree with all this. Technique can only take you so far. In the beginning they
did not have weight classes in the UFC. But it can only go that way for so long
before the stronger guys figure out how to fight. Sure a smaller guy always has
a chance to "catch" the bigger guy, but 9 times out of 10, if the technique level
is close, I'm going to put my money on the bigger guy.
talk about your story
I agree with you here, and the point is this. Technique can win over strength,
but only to a certain point. And if the stronger person also knows some
technique, then the smaller guy may even have less of a chance. I think what
started this was in the beginning the jiu-jitsu guys would say that it did not
matter how big and strong you were, that the better jiu-jitsu guy would always
win. I think we all know now that this is not true.
And your probably right. There are techniques that are "just for jiu-jitsu".
I agree that this is not the best move to try in a street fight.
Let me stop you right here. He was in your guard and trying to choke you??
He must not be a very good brown belt. One of the basic rules of jiu-jitsu is
to get position first, then execute submission. Trying to submit someone
from inside their guard is, well, stupid.
I agree with all this. Technique can only take you so far. In the beginning they
did not have weight classes in the UFC. But it can only go that way for so long
before the stronger guys figure out how to fight. Sure a smaller guy always has
a chance to "catch" the bigger guy, but 9 times out of 10, if the technique level
is close, I'm going to put my money on the bigger guy.
This was a good post to equalize things!
10-14-2005, 10:43 AM
#35
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In all honesty I've been going to the gym twice a day for the last 3 weeks and was in pretty good shape to begin with. If I get the chance at UFC I'm going to get in and represent for the Army. RANGERS LEAD THE WAY!!!!
10-14-2005, 10:52 AM
#36
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Originally Posted by leftwo
Let me stop you right here. He was in your guard and trying to choke you??
He must not be a very good brown belt. One of the basic rules of jiu-jitsu is
to get position first, then execute submission. Trying to submit someone
from inside their guard is, well, stupid.
He must not be a very good brown belt. One of the basic rules of jiu-jitsu is
to get position first, then execute submission. Trying to submit someone
from inside their guard is, well, stupid.
Like I said though, in a street fight, the guard isn't all that great of a position. It's the best you can do while you're on your back, but you're still very vulnerable to eye gouging and the guy's friends soccer kicking you in the head. Not only that, the punches are pretty bad without gloves.
The main reason I wanted to know some BJJ is that so I could gain an advantage on the ground so I could work for a full mount or someone's back. I know if I was in a fight I wouldn't hesitate to rip someone's eye out, so I'd expect the same from the person trying to hurt me. I'd rather not be wrestling around anyway. Striking in a street fight is a bigger advantage because most of the punks that want to fight on the street or in bars aren't conditioned fighters, so things like leg/groin kicks and a good jab can actually do some damage. If you watch pro MMA fights you see how cautious the fighters are of each other. In every street/bar brawl I've ever been in or seen the guys just slug it out and it's over pretty quickly unless they go to the ground where it's broken up pretty fast by bouncers or friends.
10-14-2005, 10:55 AM
#37
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Yeah, position is everything. One thing that sucks about military hand-to-hand compared to competition martial arts is that they very in extremes. I know tons of SF and Rangers that could go into the UFC and trash those guys but they wouldn't leave the ring alive. There is a big difference in training to kill and training to compete.
10-14-2005, 11:44 AM
#38
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I think the overall message here should be this. (now that we have strayed waaaay off topic).
Martial arts are like tools. A good carpenter has many tools in their belt.
Depending on the problem you are trying to solve, you use different tools.
Jiu-Jitsu should be one of these tools, but not the only tool. Would you try to build a house with just a hammer? No! Anyone who says that all you need is "X" has never tried to build a house with just a hammer
If you want to learn how to fight on the ground, lean Jiu-Jitsu or one of many new
"submission wrestling" arts that have come around recently.
If your in Daly City or nearby and want to learn Jiu-Jitsu, then come on down to Charles
Gracie's school and check it out. I promise I won't put my thumb in your eye or encourage you to go for chokes inside someones guard
Martial arts are like tools. A good carpenter has many tools in their belt.
Depending on the problem you are trying to solve, you use different tools.
Jiu-Jitsu should be one of these tools, but not the only tool. Would you try to build a house with just a hammer? No! Anyone who says that all you need is "X" has never tried to build a house with just a hammer
If you want to learn how to fight on the ground, lean Jiu-Jitsu or one of many new
"submission wrestling" arts that have come around recently.
If your in Daly City or nearby and want to learn Jiu-Jitsu, then come on down to Charles
Gracie's school and check it out. I promise I won't put my thumb in your eye or encourage you to go for chokes inside someones guard
10-14-2005, 12:01 PM
#39
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Originally Posted by leftwo
I think the overall message here should be this. (now that we have strayed waaaay off topic).
Martial arts are like tools. A good carpenter has many tools in their belt.
Depending on the problem you are trying to solve, you use different tools.
Jiu-Jitsu should be one of these tools, but not the only tool. Would you try to build a house with just a hammer? No! Anyone who says that all you need is "X" has never tried to build a house with just a hammer
If you want to learn how to fight on the ground, lean Jiu-Jitsu or one of many new
"submission wrestling" arts that have come around recently.
If your in Daly City or nearby and want to learn Jiu-Jitsu, then come on down to Charles
Gracie's school and check it out. I promise I won't put my thumb in your eye or encourage you to go for chokes inside someones guard
Martial arts are like tools. A good carpenter has many tools in their belt.
Depending on the problem you are trying to solve, you use different tools.
Jiu-Jitsu should be one of these tools, but not the only tool. Would you try to build a house with just a hammer? No! Anyone who says that all you need is "X" has never tried to build a house with just a hammer
If you want to learn how to fight on the ground, lean Jiu-Jitsu or one of many new
"submission wrestling" arts that have come around recently.
If your in Daly City or nearby and want to learn Jiu-Jitsu, then come on down to Charles
Gracie's school and check it out. I promise I won't put my thumb in your eye or encourage you to go for chokes inside someones guard
Damn good analogy...............Hit the nail on the head with this one
10-14-2005, 04:08 PM
#40
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Originally Posted by leftwo
I think the overall message here should be this. (now that we have strayed waaaay off topic).
Martial arts are like tools. A good carpenter has many tools in their belt.
Depending on the problem you are trying to solve, you use different tools.
Jiu-Jitsu should be one of these tools, but not the only tool. Would you try to build a house with just a hammer? No! Anyone who says that all you need is "X" has never tried to build a house with just a hammer
If you want to learn how to fight on the ground, lean Jiu-Jitsu or one of many new
"submission wrestling" arts that have come around recently.
If your in Daly City or nearby and want to learn Jiu-Jitsu, then come on down to Charles
Gracie's school and check it out. I promise I won't put my thumb in your eye or encourage you to go for chokes inside someones guard
Martial arts are like tools. A good carpenter has many tools in their belt.
Depending on the problem you are trying to solve, you use different tools.
Jiu-Jitsu should be one of these tools, but not the only tool. Would you try to build a house with just a hammer? No! Anyone who says that all you need is "X" has never tried to build a house with just a hammer
If you want to learn how to fight on the ground, lean Jiu-Jitsu or one of many new
"submission wrestling" arts that have come around recently.
If your in Daly City or nearby and want to learn Jiu-Jitsu, then come on down to Charles
Gracie's school and check it out. I promise I won't put my thumb in your eye or encourage you to go for chokes inside someones guard
I'll more than likely be by once classes wrap up for the semester.
Thanks!
10-14-2005, 04:09 PM
#41
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Originally Posted by 1reguL8NSTi
Yeah, position is everything. One thing that sucks about military hand-to-hand compared to competition martial arts is that they very in extremes. I know tons of SF and Rangers that could go into the UFC and trash those guys but they wouldn't leave the ring alive. There is a big difference in training to kill and training to compete.
10-14-2005, 07:02 PM
#42
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http://charlesgracie.com/students.htm
Val Cubales [Brown Belt] thats my cousin . . . i should start training again
Val Cubales [Brown Belt] thats my cousin . . . i should start training again
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